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Old 10-31-2008, 12:42 AM   #1
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Exclamation What's really at stake in this election... A final plea

EDIT: PLEASE just take the 10 mins to read through this. It will make me feel like I didn't just waste an hour writing it

Hi all, I know there are a lot of election threads on here already, but I am making this new topic because I believe there is something very serious that needs to be said about this 2008 election and I welcome all comments/criticisms, but please if your main arguments are anything like "John McCain is old" or "Obama is a terrorist", please just refrain from replying. And finally, if you are going to negative rep me for a post on my political point of view, fine; I'd rather that what I have to say gets out there than lose a few imaginary points on the forum.

And finally, I do not consider myself democrat or republican; no single party can include everything that I personally believe in (and I doubt it can for anyone), but because the only way to get things done politically in this country is with a party, then I will tell you now, you are going to see a liberal slant to what I write. I don't call it a bias - because this isn't about me being a democrat or a republican, it's about the facts and how they prove one side to be more correct. Not a bias.

I think a lot of people do not understand how unbelievably important this election is. We are currently the biggest debtor nation in the world (we used to be the greatest creditor nation), we owe trillions of dollars to countries all over the world with no democracies and no respect for human rights (we literally owe more money than there is MONEY IN THE WORLD), we are stubbornly fighting a war that General Petraeus himself has said there is no victory in, we have millions of Americans who cannot afford healthcare to keep families and children healthy, our education system is flawed and lags behind many others in the world, and most of all, America has slipped from once being the most powerful nation in the world. We will NEVER be as powerful as we were 8 years ago; this is a simple fact, and it is true both economically and for our general standing in the world and how other countries respect us. We have lost so much in the past 8 years, some of it deserves blame, some of it does not. But what we MUST see is that if we don't act soon, America's time is up.

Economically, we have trusted the Reagan policies of the "trickle down" effect and we are now seeing the detrimental effects of that flawed theory. When a country allows a HUGE percentage of its money to be controlled by a very small amount of people/corporations, corruption and greed start to destroy the capitalistic system we rely on and we are stuck in a situation where only SEVERAL of these giant companies fuck up, and the entire COUNTRY must pay. Because of a few giants on Wall Street, your economy is nearing a recession. This is not how the great American economy is meant to function, it must change. It must have a stable growth that relies on the people, the consumers, not the greed of a select few individuals. This is NOT about more government intervention. It is about REGULATION. If you let these people run wild with no regulation, they will cut corners and break rules to get to the top. And YOU will pay for it. Deregulation doesn't work, this is why the DJI has plunged into the depths of the 20th century. So THINK before you vote, before you support a candidate, WHY would you want more of this? Why let these huge companies benefit while we continue to suffer? It isn't about the size of the government, it is about fairness of the market, and being loyal to the Constitution. Barack Obama wants to change the system; he wants regulation and fairness on Wall Street. John McCain does not - read his economic policies on his website, they discuss nothing of regulation (although his economic policies change rapidly, so it is hard to tell what exactly he does support. Which leads me to my next point.) America needs a leader who exerts confidence. Without this, the economy will never recover. Bush gives us the impression of a beaten old man who just wants out, and the market continues to plunge, because he has no idea what to do. McCain gives off the EXACT same type of erratic uncertainty that terrifies investors and buyers. The economy will never recover under a McCain/Palin administration because people can never be confident. Obama has confidence and rightly so because he not only understands the economy to the fullest extent, he also surrounds himself with the most intelligent and relevant people in the field. The economy NEEDS Obama.

Also related to the economy; taxes. Nobody likes them, and most republicans simply vote republican to make sure their taxes don't go up. Well, guess what, this isn't a party issue anymore - it's about the individual. George W. Bush managed to raise taxes on Americans and double our national debt. This is why so many republicans feel betrayed by him, because he essentially disobeyed the fundamental reason many voters supported him. But now, we must look beyond the fact that we don't want to pay taxes. Nobody wants to, but think about it this way; our debt is EXACTLY like a credit card. The longer we don't pay it off, the worse it gets. So your unwillingness to pay taxes now is going to lead to your children paying the most ridiculously high taxes Americans have ever seen. Because guess what, money DOESN'T grow on trees. Republicans can say they're going to lower taxes, but WHAT EXACTLY is their plan to pay back our trillion dollar deficit? They don't fucking have one. They lie to you and they will continue to lie to you with their promises of low taxes, in exchange for what? Another exponential increase in our national debt? It doesn't matter that we are in a time of economic crisis, taxes are NOT something we can delay! Until America is in a safe standing with the amount of money we owe, the economy will struggle to recover. Republicans CONTINUE to borrow money, leaving the next president in a deeper hole of shit than the last. Clinton managed to clean it up pretty well, but Bush has absolutely destroyed any progress we once had. Again, McCain WON'T CHANGE THIS! Obama will. He will help middle class Americans who are struggling with the economy so they can flourish. But he will not help those corporations who do not deserve tax cuts. This is not some sort of communist theory, in fact it is in the foundation of our country in a little document called the Constitution - the rich pay more to help benefit the country. I can't find the exact part where it says "presidents will promise huge tax cuts to businesses and people who don't deserve them so they can get votes". But it's gotta be in there somewhere, because McCain and Palin keep citing it. Bottom line, there is no magic way to pay back trillions of dollars, and until you can think of a better way, it is paying taxes. If you have no desire to so, think at least of the next generation, because they will have to pay more because of you. And by this point, these taxes will be so high that the entire economy will be crippled and we will never be able to focus on our internal infrastructure, only paying off our debts. Doesn't this scare you?

The War in Iraq is being fought by the bravest soldiers in the world and our troops deserve the respect of every American. But you do not have to support the war to support our troops. The biggest problem with Iraq is that we did not, and do not, understand their culture. Bush invaded without understanding HOW the country works and not seeing that we cannot simply "convert" them to a democracy. This is why generals in the war have deemed it "unwinnable". There is a point where you must stop the young soldiers from dying, stop the innocent civilians from being murdered, stop the attempts to turn other countries into our own, and admit fault. In Vietnam, we stayed longer than we should have; we believed we had passed the point of no return, but failed to realize that the "victory" we sought did not even exist. So because of this, thousands of soldiers continued to die for the same exact end cause. Why do we not LEARN from history? We always say we will, and then we revert back to the exact same ways. Documents have now been surfaced that show Bush ordering the CIA and military to destroy evidence that shows there were NO WMDs in Iraq to begin with. Bush was GIVEN this information before invading, and chose to invade anyways. Yes, good things have resulted from the war - Saddam was dangerous and needed to be taken down, but a unilateral invasion was NOT the answer. (quick history lesson; the only weapons Iraq ever had was chemical/bio weapons, the most painful and slow weapons available. Guess how they got them - America. Reagan decided that Iran and Iraq were both bad, so he gave these weapons to both sides.) So instead of staying in this country while it destroys our economy and our people, we need to start thinking about how to GET OUT. The Bush administration (I use this term, because Bush himself STILL believes Iraq was a good decision and that he will be remembered as a hero for doing the right thing even though it was unpopular...) finally acknowledged this and is actually USING Obama's pull out plan. It seems McCain is the only one left who thinks there is something to be won there. Our resources are needed elsewhere, and the rest of the world is waiting for the old America to return. The America that wouldn't invade a country unilaterally with absolutely no pre-existing knowledge and reason. The best we can do now is form a plan to leave that will let Iraqis be safe and Americans come home. Obama wants to do this in his first term. Give him the chance.

See next post... I'm out of characters
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Old 10-31-2008, 12:43 AM   #2
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Default Re: What's really at stake in this election... A final plea

My final section is on campaigning and the fear tactics of the republicans. There have been a lot of dirty campaigns in the past, but nothing as disgusting and insulting as John McCain's. I used to like the man, in fact I supported him in 2000, but after this election I will never be able to see him in the same light again. He is playing on the politics of racism, hatred, and fear. Is he going out and saying "Obama is a terrorist"? No, of course not. But he is fueling the fires that bring out the most fear mongering socially backwards haters in America. People who would kill a man because of the color of his skin. People who wouldn't vote for a man because of his name sounds scary. People who ACTUALLY believe Obama wasn't born in the United States of America. I don't know HOW they get away with it; Bill Ayers was a childhood NEIGHBOR of Obama and is now a distinguished professor, and the McCain campaign translates this to Obama "Pallin' around with terrorists". And we all know this wouldn't mean shit if Obama wasn't black. As much as we'd all like to say, "no I'd be suspicious too if it was a white man", it's just NOT TRUE. Because guess what, John McCain has ties to Palestinian terrorist groups and has in fact donated a half million dollars to one of them (that they now are trying to hammer Obama for!). I am NOT bringing this up to say McCain is a terrorist, I am bring it up to say that none of those insane McCain supporters who believe Obama is a secret terrorists wouldn't think TWICE about McCain's ties to the exact same groups! It is so simply because of race, and I typically would never bring it into this election because it SHOULD be irrelevant, but it's not. If Obama was a white man with an American name, no one would think twice about these attacks. But because of his race, people actually take these attacks seriously. There is not ONE piece of evidence that suggests Obama is or ever was associated with terrorists. If there actually was evidence, the McCain camp would bring it up, instead of just using broad attacks like "Pallin' around" and "Who is the real Obama". It's total bullshit and I feel sorry for the fearful Americans who believe it. It is shameful. The campaign is trying to stoke the inner fears and stereotypes in Americans and it is actually working; it sickens me. And the funny thing is, if you asked McCain, face to face, "Do you honestly believe Obama has any ties to terrorists. Yes or no?" He would say "No.", just like he did at the debate. Because the claim is crazy and has no bearings other than to stir people's racist fears. McCain knows this, and so does his entire campaign. And so they play on this hatred and they divide Americans when they need to be united.

They talk of "real America" and "pro America", like for some reason my blue state isn't real. My blue state isn't hard working. My blue state isn't sending soldiers to die in Iraq. This is what Palin tells to these crowds of angry republicans, she does so to make them hate democrats more. She does so to rile them up and to get them to vote. Palin is the single most embarrassing and insulting person to ever be a public American figure. Her tactics are unbelievable and she manages to pull them off with a smile and some cute words. Yet, she doesn't even know the role of the OFFICE SHE IS RUNNING FOR. She believes the vice president has the power to watch over the senate and make decisions with the senate to decide important issues. READ THE FUCKING CONSTITUTION YOU LUNATIC; I'm sorry for the language, but it scares the living daylights out of me that this woman actually has a shot at becoming the vice president of our country (and scarier yet, the president). She has no power whatsoever in that aspect and if she ever tries to break that, she will be violating the only governing document left in this country that has some truth left to it. Her and McCain need to stop running on the politics of fear because it will be THEIR fault if Obama is elected and then killed by one of their crazy supporters. Because, while they themselves aren't saying kill him, they are certainly not trying to put out the fire; they are doing all they can to ignite it without officially getting their dirty paws in it. Don't stoop to their lies. Don't fall for their traps. We are smarter than this and we are better than this. If you actually have doubts about the candidate, look them up for yourself. I won't waste more time here by showing you the exact evidence that counters every one of the McCain smears, but trust me it's all out there. Start here if you are genuinely concerned: http://fightthesmears.com . Educate yourselves before buying into their ungrounded and offensive lies. If this is how they run their campaign, can you IMAGINE how they will run this country?

In conclusion, there is SO much more here at stake than just some old guy becoming president. You need to understand how important this is, so when someone asks you who you support and why, you can tell them. And then hopefully they can understand. The conservatives already have a 5:4 advantage in the supreme court; they will try to overturn important cases that destroy our rights and liberties as humans if John McCain is elected, because he will appoint MORE conservative justices. These liberties our things our founding fathers gave to us and they are trying to take away. You should be angry that your government is wiretapping you and watching everything you do. It is a blatant rape of the Constitution and Bush deserves to be impeached simply for that act. This election is no longer about talking points; one side will continue to get strong votes because people fear other races, homosexuals, and a woman's right to choose. If this steady base continues, they WILL win the election and America will be out of chances. This is our last opportunity to act and to fix what we have broken. Otherwise you will no longer be looking at America as the great nation of economic strength and power than the rest of the world admires. You will be waking up to see an unfree China as the new leader of the world, because this election is unlike any other, it is about our right and our ability to keep leading the world. If you believe America is the best country for the job, you need to vote for Barack Obama in this election. I believe that America is the best and the only country for the job; we have a lot of repairing to do, but we can still win back the respect we once had. But we cannot do this with John McCain as our president, and if he is elected we will never have this chance again. We are OUT OF TIME, America.

Vote on Tuesday, November 4th. If you can't vote, talk to those who can. This election is by no means won by either candidate; don't believe the polls, you will become over confident and lose everything we could have had. Keep in mind what's really in store here and make the best choice for America, because you have never and will never be part of such an important historic decision.

Thanks CF... sorry that was a bit long but I think if you read through it you will find most of the points to be necessary
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Old 10-31-2008, 12:45 AM   #3
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Default Re: What's really at stake in this election... A final plea

GAAA!!! My eyes are burning!!!
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Old 10-31-2008, 12:46 AM   #4
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Default Re: What's really at stake in this election... A final plea

Sorry >.< try to read it! It's not a simple issue, it doesn't get a simple explanation
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Old 10-31-2008, 12:52 AM   #5
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Default Re: What's really at stake in this election... A final plea

Quote:
Originally Posted by jervin32189 View Post
GAAA!!! My eyes are burning!!!
same here...

i am working on reading it ...may take a little LOL
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Old 10-31-2008, 12:57 AM   #6
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Default Re: What's really at stake in this election... A final plea

I'd have enough trouble reading that if I was sober.
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Old 10-31-2008, 12:57 AM   #7
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Default Re: What's really at stake in this election... A final plea

Quote:
Originally Posted by lukaszr View Post
same here...

i am working on reading it ...may take a little LOL
Thank you!! I appreciate it
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Old 10-31-2008, 12:58 AM   #8
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Default Re: What's really at stake in this election... A final plea

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackson.MacKenzie View Post
Thank you!! I appreciate it
almost done...

np Mate
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Old 10-31-2008, 01:00 AM   #9
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Default Re: What's really at stake in this election... A final plea

I've read it all. I mostly agree, if we have any shy chance in hell, it's with Obama. McCain is a no win situation.
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Old 10-31-2008, 01:01 AM   #10
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Default Re: What's really at stake in this election... A final plea

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The biggest problem with Iraq is that we did not, and do not, understand their culture. Bush invaded without understanding HOW the country works and not seeing that we cannot simply "convert" them to a democracy.
Amen to that!! o....how many times have i said this to people...and i only get a cold shoulder.

You've written up a great read. your views and your facts are full of sense. its a long read....but definitely hits the nail on the head. Great write up...if i could...i'd give 10rep.
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