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Old 02-06-2005, 09:29 AM   #151
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Default Re: war talk

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Originally Posted by tha_bommer
What do you mean by that?
Is Giancarlo really that bad??
heres my example of giancrlo...take a piec of gyprock and try to teach it to fall down by itself...it wont, but take a basball bat and smash it at knee height and the thing will fall and lose its stubborness. this works well with giancarlo. i prefer an aluminum bat since you can recycle it afterward. what im trying to get at here is its like talking to a wall
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Old 02-06-2005, 05:38 PM   #152
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Default Re: war talk

nofx, you have it again man!!! OUR special forces are the best, its just that ours arent so well known as your Delta force, your navy seals, and your SAS. Our forces were YOUR army's eyes in Iraq and Afghanistan too i think.

Oh and who ever it was tha that had a go about the Gurkas teaching ur special forces, mate, the gurkas ARENT your special forces, just your teachers, i missed that point, thanks for clarifying it.

the gurkas are the ultimate elites, they are loaned out as i understand it. from who i dont know.
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Old 02-07-2005, 03:18 AM   #153
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Default Re: war talk

AMD ZEN:

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No, the GSG-9 are different. The KSK is made for ultra stealth and deep recon missions.. They are highly trained killing machines capable for sneaking past almost anything.
Not at all. The German Military has fallen back on emphasis for such units because of shortfalls in funding.
ALVINO:
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Well, any bullet hurts. When I read Black Hawk Down (a REALLY good book), according to the Rangers and Delta Force operators, they had to fire multiple times just to drop a Somali (and they used 5.56mm). The CAR-15, fared even worse. It's "Green-Tip" bullet, had a tip made with Tungsten Carbide went right through the person, resulting in the use of multiple bullets just to get someone down and dead. Alot of the Delta operators realized that Gary Gordon or Randy Shugart (I forgot which one), was really smart by using a old M-14 rifle back from the Vietnam days (and it used 7.62mm), because it could drop an enemy with less rounds than a 5.56mm can. But, the 5.56mm is a very reliable, cheap, easy to produce/ transport and deadly round. The 7.62mm is only cumbersone because it's big, expensive and harder to transport (due to weight, thanks to the size of the cartriges).
I never heard of this. The problem with 7.62MM is that it is far too slow firing, the 5.56MM is much faster and more bullets can be dispersed to make up for any differences in changes. The CAR-15 was not in service in Somalia by the way... the M-4 was. It was an early variant of the M-16. The M-16 was improved in the A1 Model, which had improved ballistics eliminating all the problems you spoke about. The M-16A2 improved further on this, and the US Military has been overall very satisfied with the M-16, whereas the military was EXTREMELY DISSATISFIED with the M-14, which had the tendency to contain glaring errors with dispersal. Here is the proof:

"The M14 was the standard Army infantry rifle, until replaced by the mass fielding of the M16 5.56mm rifle in 1966-1967. Some M14s were equipped with a bipod for use as a squad automatic weapons. However, the M14 displayed an erratic dispersion pattern, excessive recoil, and muzzle climb when fired as an automatic rifle."

The rifle obviously had huge problems. Erratic dispersion is not acceptable in the field of battle, nor is muzzle climb. The M-14 is great as sniper rifle or when a two-three shots are fired at a time, but other then that forget it. Now obviously I would choose an M-16 over an M-14 because it is smarter and these problems that are talked about can cause problems in the field of battle. If you can't hold sustained fire on an enemy that has an AK-47, you are in trouble. So the M-14 is definitely a mistake to have for anything other then sniper duties.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/m14.htm
"The M24 Sniper Weapon System, fielded in 1988, represents a return to bolt action sniper rifles by the US Army. As in the US Marine M40A1, the M24 uses the Remington 700 receiver group, although the reciever has been made for adaptation to take the .300 Winchester Magnum round. The stock (HS Precision) is made of a composite of Kevlar, graphite and fibreglass bound together with epoxy resins, and features an aluminium bedding block and adjustable butt plate. A detachable bipod can be attached to the stocks fore-end. The M24 is equipped with a 10X fixed Leupold M3 Ultra telescope."

However, we did go back to the M24, somewhat based on the same ballistics of the M-14.
Morpheus:
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Sorry Giancarlo but I have to disagree the SAS is the best in the world that's what most people say then come the Navy SEAL's and then Shin Beth
Not quite. The Delta Forces are the better trained forces, and far better then the SAS in most respects.
The Bommer:
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Where are the WMDs that your leader spoke of?
I haven't heard one word about them...
Then you aren't paying any attention at all because quite a few munitions containing chemical weapons have been discovered in Iraq. Also there are reports that a lot of the weaponry left the country because the world did not act fast enough. Well that'll be our own problem. We all remember those videos of Al Qaeda operatives testing chemical weapons on dogs and other animals. You better hope that none of the WMDs Saddam had ended up in their hands.
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And the parading of Iraqi prisoners on american television is against the geneva convention, while when the Al Jazeera network showed american POWs receiving medical help America "complained" that it was against the geneva convention.
Al Jazeera network is by far the most non-credible source you could ever quoted, in fact they were banned from Iraq for staunchly biased reporting against the Iraqi Republic. American POWs receiving medical help? The ones captured by Saddam during the beginning of the war? They weren't receiving medical help. Including one Jessica Lynch who was raped by capturors. The US did not violate the Geneva convention.
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www.sorryeverybody.com <http://www.sorryeverybody.com> is a great american site... its for a book with americans apologising for re-electing bush.
That site is full of foolish people. Sorry about democracy? Go move to Cuba. You people can't be sorry for a decision I made in casting a vote for Bush. You can't be apologizing for something you didn't do. I can't stand that site. Those people should be ashamed of themselves.
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ANOTHER thing is that we have only just take our FIRST AUSTRALIAN CASUALTY so far in this war. we have had wounded certainly, but no deaths until now!
Are your forces in the most volatile regions? I didn't think so. Last I heard you were in the Shi'a areas which are very secure. You are posted in an area where there are almost no suicide attacks at all. That explains why you have suffered few casualities. The Canadians did a pretty good job in sniper duties in Afghanistan, but wait.. you are talking about Australia.. well the US trains your forces, so naturally the US Military is far better.

The US military is battle hardened. That's the difference between them and the rest of the military forces you guys talk about. There is also something called experience, and the US has far more of it then Britain, Germany, Canada, Scotland, France and many other countries out there.
Quote:
nofx, you have it again man!!! OUR special forces are the best, its just that ours arent so well known as your Delta force, your navy seals, and your SAS. Our forces were YOUR army's eyes in Iraq and Afghanistan too i think.
Your special forces are trained by ours. They certainly aren't the best. Additionally, the US army's eyes in Afghanistan were that of the Northern Alliance (these were Afghan militia forces). In Iraq it was the US Spec Ops. You guys stayed in Shi'a territory by the way. The US went into Sunni territory where your politicians NEVER EVEN dared to send in their forces because of fear of getting shot up.
Nofx:
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Lets just say, he has very strong views and no matter how much you prove him wrong he will stick by them.
I don't get proven wrong in this field.
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eres my example of giancrlo...take a piec of gyprock and try to teach it to fall down by itself...it wont, but take a basball bat and smash it at knee height and the thing will fall and lose its stubborness. this works well with giancarlo. i prefer an aluminum bat since you can recycle it afterward. what im trying to get at here is its like talking to a wall
That's something more applicable for yourself, not me. You just need to learn to mature a bit.
Also if you guys want to know about the most battle hardened special troops in the world, lets talk about the Colombian Elite Forces. These guys will tear apart the Gurkhas, and whatever other unit you can name. There is something that 20 years of constant battle does to a military. It either wipes it out, or strengthens it. In recent years, the Colombian Elite Forces only gained in strength. Now they have rapid reaction units. The Colombian Military is one of the best in the western hemisphere, perhaps matching the US in training and even exceeding it in experience (not power, of course because Colombia is a smaller country).
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Old 02-07-2005, 03:43 AM   #154
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Default Re: war talk

Gian made sense AND good points... and it was all in ONE POST.

yup, ok so we're trained by ur guys who have more experience... where do the gurkas fit into it?????
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Old 02-07-2005, 03:43 AM   #155
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And the parading of Iraqi prisoners on american television is against the geneva convention, while when the Al Jazeera network showed american POWs receiving medical help America "complained" that it was against the geneva convention.
Quote:
Al Jazeera network is by far the most non-credible source you could ever quoted, in fact they were banned from Iraq for staunchly biased reporting against the Iraqi Republic. American POWs receiving medical help? The ones captured by Saddam during the beginning of the war? They weren't receiving medical help. Including one Jessica Lynch who was raped by capturors. The US did not violate the Geneva convention.
Yeah. The complaint first came when they aired the video of the 4 or 5 people who had been captured in the same attack that jessica lynch was wounded and were forced to give their name and rank. Try to stick to the truth. Dont emilish it then play on human nature by saying that they aired video of them giving medical attention. Cuz that is false.

Why do people hate america so much that they make up lies about us? It must be because we are so evil or something.

Thats another thing. The terrorists say they hate us because of baywatch. Give me a break. If they payed any attention to other countries television. They would find that america has the most conservative airways out of ANY nation on this earth. That is a fact so dont try to challenge it.

------------------------------

Oh yeah and thank you Gian for taking the high road.
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Old 02-07-2005, 03:47 AM   #156
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Default Re: war talk

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Originally Posted by airiox
Thats another thing. The terrorists say they hate us because of baywatch. Give me a break. If they payed any attention to other countries television. They would find that america has the most conservative airways out of ANY nation on this earth. That is a fact so dont try to challenge it.
Well, I'd kinda doubt that.. because watching cable TV... umm hahahah.. well unless you are talking about Bravo TV and Cinemax.. this nation is perhaps the most liberal. Queer As Folk.. heh...

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Oh yeah and thank you Gian for taking the high road.
I said what I had to. I took the statements people were making and reacted to them. Corrective statements were issued.
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Old 02-07-2005, 03:50 AM   #157
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Default Re: war talk

yeah theres some whacked stuff that makes its way onto TV, here and over there too id guess. but really, baywatch??? jeeze, u'd think that they could pick a decent program to hate you over! I can understand them hating the british because they made the damned tellytubbies!
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Old 02-07-2005, 03:54 AM   #158
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Default Re: war talk

If they hate the teletubbies why not just get the rest of the world to kick thier ass for them since some people hate them alot!
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Old 02-07-2005, 03:55 AM   #159
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Originally Posted by Assassin_666
I can understand them hating the british because they made the damned tellytubbies!
Lol that show pwns!

Seriously. Sorry to say but american television is far more conservative than any other nation. Last time I checked I have never seen someone get their head sawed off. Nor have I seen people do the weather in the nude.

Also Cable is payed for. So anything can go on there. I am talking about public airwaves. Our network TV is far more conservative than even these Muslim nations that hate us so much.
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Old 02-07-2005, 03:57 AM   #160
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Default Re: war talk

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Seriously. Sorry to say but american television is far more conservative than any other nation. Last time I checked I have never seen someone get their head sawed off. Nor have I seen people do the weather in the nude.
I really can't agree with that. I'm sorry.

But if you go on cinemax or bravo you would catch my drift. Also there is the formation of a gay channel which is on standard airwaves (not any addition). It is being sponspored by MTV, also on airwaves. MTV is another channel I can cite showing the US is not more conservative.

Quote:
Also Cable is payed for. So anything can go on there. I am talking about public airwaves. Our network TV is far more conservative than even these Muslim nations that hate us so much.
I still don't agree with that... I can't.. I've seen enough of cable TV to know... and I've been in europe. Certainly Europe television is more liberal then the US, but muslim nations television programming is not less conservative then the US's.
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