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Old 03-22-2014, 08:43 PM   #81
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difference is i'm not out of my depth claiming to have knowledge in something I dont . I am fully aware of the limitations of economic research that I have carried out and would rather understate the knowledge that I have and bow to the superior knowledge of root , fair play to him he knows his stuff .But with my limited knowledge I am also clearly aware of yours , if someone claims to know about economics they should really know about the stronger currencies in the world . It would appear to me your "research" has entailed reading one too many republican blogs which dont consider the world to be any bigger than the USA
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Old 03-22-2014, 08:45 PM   #82
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difference is i'm not out of my depth claiming to have knowledge in something I dont . I am fully aware of the limitations of economic research that I have carried out and would rather understate the knowledge that I have and bow to the superior knowledge of root , fair play to him he knows his stuff .But with my limited knowledge I am also clearly aware of yours , if someone claims to know about economics they should really know about the stronger currencies in the world . It would appear to me your "research" has entailed reading one too many republican blogs which dont consider the world to be any bigger than the USA
To us, the world isn't any bigger than us, because we have to fix what is going on in our country. Sure, things do happen like Ukraine asking us to get their troops out of Crimea, but our president needs to fix the problems he's created or we're going to go under
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Old 03-22-2014, 09:04 PM   #83
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To us, the world isn't any bigger than us, because we have to fix what is going on in our country. Sure, things do happen like Ukraine asking us to get their troops out of Crimea, but our president needs to fix the problems he's inherited or we're going to go under
there I fixed that for you the world was already 2 years into an economic crisis when he assumed office .

the thing is as he draws to the end of his term he isn't going to do anything radical , one there wont be legislative time and two it wont make any difference to his legacy and there is no chance of re election all politicians are the same no president is going to come up with anything radical towards the end of their second term if they take one there's no motivation for them anymore .

The fact is when talking about economics the world is bigger than the US , the economic recovery can only happen if the worldwide economic conditions are favorable and for that you need to think much bigger than whats going on in just the USA

as for intervention in Ukraine , i haven't made my mind up . However my gut feeling is I dont think its our place in the west to get involved given our activities in the middle east the past 10 years . But if there was a true need for humanitarian intervention we should intervene regardless of the economic condition of our own country , right up until things getting so bad we have a need for our military in our own country
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Old 03-22-2014, 09:37 PM   #84
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there I fixed that for you the world was already 2 years into an economic crisis when he assumed office .

the thing is as he draws to the end of his term he isn't going to do anything radical , one there wont be legislative time and two it wont make any difference to his legacy and there is no chance of re election all politicians are the same no president is going to come up with anything radical towards the end of their second term if they take one there's no motivation for them anymore .

The fact is when talking about economics the world is bigger than the US , the economic recovery can only happen if the worldwide economic conditions are favorable and for that you need to think much bigger than whats going on in just the USA

as for intervention in Ukraine , i haven't made my mind up . However my gut feeling is I dont think its our place in the west to get involved given our activities in the middle east the past 10 years . But if there was a true need for humanitarian intervention we should intervene regardless of the economic condition of our own country , right up until things getting so bad we have a need for our military in our own country
That' a touchy subject too. I mean, we didn't help the Afgahns after their conflict with the USSR and our covert war, and that bit us in the a$$. So what do we do about Ukraine? They could be a big ally if the world ever goes into WWIII god forbid that ever happens, but we also don't want to start WWIII by intervening
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Old 03-22-2014, 09:47 PM   #85
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my gut feeling is I dont think at the moment we should intervene , there is no humanitarian crisis going on , if Russia started massacring people in Ukraine to the level happened in Kosovo or something like that then we should intervene for obvious reasons . But at the moment it would be a bit hypocritical for us to tell Russia it cant look after its interests in a completely destabilized volatile country bordered to it when we intervened in the way we have done in history to protect interests overseas . (we=nato nations)

I think what is needed is close monitoring of the situation as well as monitoring of diplomatic channels in that part of the world and a calculated decision to be made if intervention is going to be carried out
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Old 03-22-2014, 09:49 PM   #86
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my gut feeling is I dont think at the moment we should intervene , there is no humanitarian crisis going on , if Russia started massacring people in Ukraine to the level happened in Kosovo or something like that then we should intervene for obvious reasons . But at the moment it would be a bit hypocritical for us to tell Russia it cant look after its interests in a completely destabilized volatile country bordered to it when we intervened in the way we have done in history to protect interests overseas . (we=nato nations)

I think what is needed is close monitoring of the situation as well as monitoring of diplomatic channels in that part of the world and a calculated decision to be made if intervention is going to be carried out
The thing I really do not like in this is since one country falls, then more might fall. Just like Hitler and the Sudetenland, and Austria. We need to stop Putin from continuing if he tries to do it again
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Old 03-22-2014, 10:00 PM   #87
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I think the world has learnt some very big lessons from WW2 amongst other previous conflicts , and I hope we would not let history repeat itself . We now have the doctrine of Humanitarian intervention which showing how times have advanced .

The big difference between WW2 and what is happening here is that Ukraine and Russia share a border , Ukraine has become destabilized , Russia is obviously concerned about this and seeks to do something to protect its interests whilst I dont agree that it needs to lead a full blown invasion of Ukraine to do this I dont think they pose a threat to the wider world in doing this .During WW2 im sure you aware Hitler invaded countries just to spread his message /realize his ambition of large scale ethnic cleansing

The same way that border control resources in the USA are focused on your border with Mexico not the border with Canada because of the obvious crime problem within Mexico . If you share a border with a country that is less politicaly stable/civil/has a massive crime problem you will obviously want to do something to mitigate the risk of that migrating into and destabilizing your own country .

Whilst Putin is a dangerous man,his danger is down to his intelligence . He is nowhere near mad enough to think that he can take over the world in the same way that Hitler had that ambition and belief .
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Old 03-22-2014, 10:03 PM   #88
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The admisn have said NOT to go off topic probably once every page by now... But since we are there anyways, and no one is stopping, I'll finish it by saying, WW3 is on it's way, it's going to happen, sooner or later, ( later not more than a decade away ).
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Old 03-23-2014, 07:11 AM   #89
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Ah but it can very well be the correct weapon based on your hunting needs:

Interesting but as stated in the video clip ..... controversial.

My belief in hunting is a clean humane kill with one shot, a wounded animal suffers & is very dangerous in some cases.
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Old 03-23-2014, 11:13 AM   #90
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If you READ my posts, I said that it also had to do with the amount of money in circulation.
Yes, inflation is affected by the amount of money in circulation.

and if you hadn't noticed banks all over the world have been printing money like it's going out of fashion under the name of quantitative easing.



BASICALLY.

by your two measures, either the price of gold -well that's way up, so adjust for inflation and you end up in the position that it's not as bad as it first looks.

or, look at the money in circulation, of which thanks to QE there is more.
so again adjust for the inflation that creates and you end up in the same position.

that's where the problem is, at first glance you say silly man added more to the debt than anyone before him.
that's a fact, he's added near six trillion to the debt, that's not only more than anyone else before him (as a big number) but of you take a president like Washington, it's also more money than there was in the entire world! -at that time.
I.E other presidents have added lots of debt, and as a percentage of GDP things have been worse.

the point is, if you just regurgitate random facts from policy sites that happen to agree with the team that you side with, without understanding the core facts below, it makes for a fairly baseless argument!

so whichever of the ways or measures that YOU stated, when you account for inflation by whatever way YOU stated you prove your own argument wrong! if not wrong then at least massively reduced.

I should probably say in big letters now, make no mistake, you're still all shafted cause that's a bloody huge pile of money that you owe!
I don't think that the man is fiscally responsible at all.
I do think that he (like a lot of other people in charge before him) is a lot more bothered about being remembered than actually doing good.
and that sort of ego mania whilst present in most if not all politicians doesn't make for good governance...




but again this is where that world market comes into play.
because it's not just the nation that owns that debt, (i.e it's not just government bonds or pensions savings, but also other countries that have bought bonds from the government.

i.e a part of that 6 trillion is also yen and yuan, (in fact china is a huge buyer of US dollars), with that country so rapidly developing, is actually turns out that the issue is lessened due to inflation there as well.

i.e you owe china 1bn dollars, that converts to 1tn of their money.

1 on their money used to be a farmers wages for a day.
however, as wages go up there, things are becoming more expensive there, inflation all over the world in other countries that you are debtors to helps reduce the VALUE (though not the total) of the debt.

that 1tn of their money used to be 1tn loaves of bread, now it's not.


that's why money at a government level and Global finance of interconnected economies is so very difficult to understand.

then when you also start talking about structured vs unstructured debt it gets even more difficult.

basically though, government loans are very different to personal loans, in a personal loan you have a normal maximum repayment term of 35 years (mortgage) and an interest rate of say 2% above base rate. (for my country this is 2.5% though most mortgage lenders will charge 3 - 5% on a loan. (lets say 5%)
with inflation running at 3.5% if you leave the loan without any repayments, the loan VALUE and total always increases, e.g last year you owed 100,000, this year you own 105,000.

last year 100,000 bought a million tins of beans, his year a million tins of beans actually costs 103,500 . (where the commodity market I choose to reference here is food) so you see my debt is not only a 5,000 bigger number, but I also need and extra 2000 odd "insert commodity here" to pay it off...

government bonds are sold on 100 year terms, and have a current interest rate (in my country of 0.5%)
thus if the us borrows 100,000 from the UK next year the US will owe the UK 100,500.

you see the point here, now the US only needs nine hundred thousand odd tins of beans to pay back the government loan.

you inflate the price of the commodity at a rate that is lower than that of the interest rate, governments *Can* inflate their debs away.

However, uncontrolled inflation is pretty bad.
quantitative easing (that both of our governments has been doing works out terrible for anyone who actually HAS got money, (look around that's actually more than you think) what this means is that any one with money, who has invested in government bonds (savers in pension scheme -I.e MOST) have only seen a rate of return of a couple of percent IF they are lucky, mean while QE has been putting inflation into overdrive, which has actually reduced the VALUE of their savings, - though the monetary amount may have gone up, the value of that money has gone down.

you may ask WHY would a government (any government) lend at a rate lower than it's inflation rates given that it is effectivly giving away money.

well, the idea is that if we have that money now, then it's good to spend it, in long term investments that will ensure that there is money coming into the country when times are harder...

AND when you're done doing all of that weird maths, you think figure out how different countries have different rates at which they can borrow at! so a banker in London can walk into the Bank of England and say I want to borrow 1bn money (we'll use the words money to make it easy and not worry about currency signs or conversions).
he borrows said money at 0.5%

he then tells a guy in the government of your country he's willing to lend at a rate of 1%, your government jumps at the chance, because not only can they over the next hundred years, inflate the value of that debt to nothing, but also, they can take that same billion money and lend it to Greece at 3.5%.

the London banker, and the US government all made money.
the UK government get's it's assured return of income, (useful for long term strategy planning).
the US gets free money -because it inflates it's debt to nothing.
AND it has sold a bond and so should get a regular and steady return on that bond -useful for long term planning...



Does that start to make a bit more sense now?

I'm not taking the mick when I tell you that knowing about economics is more than understanding that the value of pumpkin farms rise from early summer as yield can start to be estimated, but then fall off right after Halloween when we suddenly have no appetite for them!

Working in a shop IS useful, and can teach you in real terms and real time about stock levels, seasonal sales etc, and therefore if and when you have a spare bunch of money you can gamble it with a bit more prowess than I could without that experience on a stock market. but it's not going to teach you a lot about global interconnected economies.


(as a side note I'm pretty sure you can't just wander into the Bank of England and ask for a billion quid).


As for sandy hook being a government conspiracy.
I'm yet to see any real or compelling evidence, there are things like that largely debunked video.
interesting that the editor says that they grew up "searching for the truth" in 9/11 reports etc, it seems to work on the same theory, "government is Bad and would do anything -including murder it's own civilians to get what it wants".

I'm not convinced.
show me real and compelling evidence. and I'd be more convinced. (i.e I'm not a closed book on the subject I like a good conspiracy as much as the next).
and various, wars, weapons test, virus vaccine tests, etc have shown that when you get to an "untouchable" place in government you can do some pretty messed up stuff and get away with it.
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