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Old 03-13-2008, 12:53 AM   #51
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Default Re: Presidential Elections!

The upcoming presidential election will be the first election I can vote in and sadly I'm not to crazy about any of the candidates so far, I do not like the Democratic party as we know it now. I suppose I would be considered a Republican by my political views. I'm not a passionate Republican though, if the candidate I liked was Democrat then I'd vote for him. I vote for person, not party...although the folks I like TYPICALLY are Republican

I don't like either Clinton or Obama, I feel neither really share my views or have the same values as me. I think pulling out of Iraq would be a mistake, it was a mistake going in because Al Qaeda and WMD's weren't there...but Al Qaeda and other Islamic Radicals are there now and if the war on terror is again radical Islam then Iraq is a crucial piece of the puzzle in combating that evil, pulling out won't do a lick of good.

This is something I truly believe in, in this day and age with our dwindling armed forces personal being scattered asunder across our world in more and more places I know there is a good chance my country may need to call on me, as well as the other young men of my generation to step up to the plate and serve.
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Old 03-13-2008, 06:35 AM   #52
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mayorredbeard, I have to say that I totally agree with you. Obama has no plan at all. Change change change is all that he seems to know how to say. I hope he never wins.

Illmatic, I do have to say that we will have to agree to disagree, especially on the topic of abortion. I was born with many health problems, and I still live with them now. My parents could have had me killed: but, I'm thankful they allowed me that chance at life, even if I spend every single day in pain and fatigue. There is so much more to living. I've been able to touch so many. If I were aborted, I'd never have that chance.

I feel that it is selfish for a woman to end the life of a child. In many cases, it is selfishness and not wanting to own up to responsibility. As far as I’m concerned, we treat criminals better than babies: but, that is for another time to discuss. To conclude on the abortion topic, partial birth abortion is sick and barbaric!

On the topic of religion and politics, I agree totally. It is not religion that makes up a person's values, morals, and character, but one's spirituality. Religion has caused people to kill one another. Religion has caused ones to hate others. I'm not about religion but about being spiritual. I can agree with you there about the religion not having its place with politics. But, as far as I’m concerned, a good leader must have good morals and values, and Obama doesn't have those.

Despite the checks and balances system, why would anyone want to vote for someone who'd even support communism or have any affiliation with it? Our country wasn't founded on such things. What happened to hating it? I feel that people are lowering their standards. Too many fall for anything. No doubt, the world has seemed to get worse overtime.

And, about a woman ruler, I can't say that I'm intolerant in the slightest. There are just values and standards that I uphold, and I refuse to lower them and forsake them for any reason, and that applies to all my values and standpoints on issues. I do not change because others criticize me.

Considering I'm a woman, I feel I can better state the fact that she has her place. To many, I seem old fashioned: but, I'm satisfied with it. So long as she is not being abused and mistreated, she should know her place. She can own businesses, run a home if the husband cannot, and be a leader of a certain community group: however, ruling over a nation--no, not her job. There are limits. Many women hate my views: but, some still support them.

BTW, I used Microsoft spell check. Happy? LOL! Kinda funny that making you mad made you critique my spelling. Kinda cute, actually!

I appreciate your reply to my post though. You do put up a good debate. I gotta give you props for that. You were very thorough.

Oh, one more thing;

Thanks for disagreeing politely.
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Old 03-14-2008, 04:39 PM   #53
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Default Re: Presidential Elections!

None of your points against Obama make any sense whatsoever. Furthermore, you link to no credible sources.

We live in America. We are a free country. Abortion should be up to the woman, simple as that. Just because you're against it doesn't mean you can press your beliefs onto others.

About the pin thing, you're paranoid. That's ridiculous.

As for experience, who cares? He's clearly qualified, and he's done a good job thus far in what he has done. Let's see...Governor Spitzer, he had experience, right? And what did he do?

But what really pisses me off about your post...he lacks character? You don't know this man at all, how can you say that? That's like me saying you lack character. Clearly your opinion is just greatly biased.

And the last point, go watch one of the many debates...
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Old 03-14-2008, 11:28 PM   #54
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Default Re: Presidential Elections!

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Originally Posted by Waldorf PC View Post
I do not want Hillary to win because;
1. She talks out of both sides of her mouth.
2. she wants to implement plans that will no doubt, raise taxs. I'm not in favor of raising taxes, as i'm a small business owner. It will also affect everyone else since the prices of goods will rise.
3. she is a woman, and as far as I'm concerned, women should not be rulers. Men were made to be heads.
4. She looks a bit psycho in the eyes.
Huck was a great guy. It is too bad that he lost. I agree with you that Hillary would be a terrible thing for our country if she were elected President. Lol.... she does have a bit of a psycho look about her! What worries me is that the craziness goes deeper than just looks!!! I don't like higher taxes or her stance on illegal immigration. Not to mention the fact that Bill would break records for being the ugliest "First Lady" in US history.

Hussein Obama would be just as bad as Hillary....if not worse. It is not his lack of experience that bothers me, but his overall lack of ethics and the fact that he doesn't seem able to state where he stands on so many subjects. His communist links are scary. I for one, cannot bring myself to vote for a guy who would love to decorate the oval office with his favorite Che Guevara flag......

I don't consider McCain to be a true republican or a true conservative, but I would rather for him to win than I would Obama or Hillary. This is my first year to be able to vote in a presidential election, and there is such a terrible selection of candidates to choose from. I really don't like any of the three of them. I definitely don't like anyone in the democrat party. The candidates that I like are usually republican, but I am not so into one party that I wouldn't vote for a democrat if one ever comes along that I like.

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Originally Posted by Illmatic View Post
I'd like to point out that in the video, he is the only candidate singing. Also, here is a picture of George H.W. Bush not putting his hand over his heart during the anthem. It isn't uncommon and in no way does it make someone patriotic.
The obvious difference is that Obama "meant what he did (by not saluting) and did what he meant!"

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Originally Posted by freestyler105 View Post
None of your points against Obama make any sense whatsoever. Furthermore, you link to no credible sources.

We live in America. We are a free country. Abortion should be up to the woman, simple as that. Just because you're against it doesn't mean you can press your beliefs onto others.
What exactly do you consider to be "credible sources"? Is Obama himself credible enough??? Here are a few interesting quotes - all Obama's own words. I don't know about you guys, but I have a big problem with voting for anyone who would say some of these things.

"My friends, we live in the greatest nation in the history of the world. I hope you'll join with me as we try to change it." ~~ Barack Obama

"What I value most about Pastor Wright is not his day-to-day political advice," Obama said. "He's much more of a sounding board for me to make sure that I am speaking as truthfully about what I believe as possible and that I'm not losing myself in some of the hype and hoopla and stress that's involved in national politics." ~~ Barack Obama concerning his long-time pastor and mentor whose shocking anti-American comments you have probably heard.

"I will stand with the Muslims should the political winds shift in an ugly direction." ~~ From 'The Audacity Of Hope'

"The person who made me proudest of all, though, was [half brother] Roy .. He converted to Islam." ~~ Quote from Barack Obama's book, Dreams Of My Father

And one from his wife, Michelle.....

"For the first time in my adult lifetime, I am really proud of my country. And not just because Barack has done well, but because I think people are hungry for change. I have been desperate to see our country moving in that direction." ~~ 44 Year old Michelle Obama.. adult since 1982


As far as abortion goes, I consider it to be the equivalent to legalized murder. No one should have the right to kill a defenseless child. Babies are just as human before they are born as they are after. Partial birth abortion is an especially cruel and sick method. If a person murders a pregnant mother, then he will be prosecuted for the murder of not one, but two lives. And yet it is legal in some states for a mother to take away that same baby's life by means of abortion. There is one question that I am going to ask concerning this subject. Think long and hard about it. Can we really expect someone like Obama who sees no value in the lives of our Nation's unborn children to see any value in the lives and educations of our children who were given the opportunity to be born?
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Old 03-15-2008, 07:19 PM   #55
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Lightbulb Re: Presidential Elections!

freestyler105, yeah, what do you consider to be credible? I've heard all of the debates. I've researched each candidate thoroughly. I've stayed on top of every news station. I've visited their sites. I've listened to interviews. I've listened to Obama speak, and like I said, he can only say change change change change. Wow! A toddler can say more. He has no sense of direction. I'd like to know why you think he is qualified for the job other than the fact he is above the age of thirty-five.

If you can tell me, I'll listen to you. Everyone has a fair say.

I'm truly sorry that my post pissed you off. But, can you please tell me where it is right to take a baby who can clearly live outside the womb, rip it's limbs off while it is screaming and crying, puncturing the skul and sucking the brains out of it's head, leaving it in an unsanitary storage room to rot until death, drowning it, crushing it's skull, or other barbaric torturous and inhumane killing methods?

and you call this a choice?

A choice?

No, it is murder!!!!!!!!!

It is disgusting!

It is barbaric!

These women should die and be forced to suffer the same pain!!!!!!!!!!

You put a DOG out of it's misery better than that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What is the price on human life these days? It's pretty cheap it seems. Yeah, America is a free country: but, is life free and indespensible? I don't think that the founding fathers had it in mind that American freedoms gave the right to decide if another person lives or dies. That is not why this country was founded. Please, do your research on American history.

And answer this question;

When there is a house fire, do you run around at the last minute trying to salvage every last material possession risking your life: or, do you preserve your life and get out thankful to be alive?

Please, think very, very long and hard before you respond.

I won't vote for a barbarian who has clearly no ethics and no regard for human life! If I did, God aught to come down and strike me dead RIGHT NOW as I live and breathe right here on this computer of mine.

and, you may ask how I can determine if this man has no character? Well, let's see. I've heard him talk. I've heard his views. What better of a source than coming right from the horses mouth? Jee, it can't get more credible than that.

And, MacGirl, thanks for coming to my defense. You did raise alot of great points. Jee, why is it that one who kills a pregnant woman can be charged for taking both lives? Yet, the woman can take the same life and get off? Since when did women have the same choices as God to decide who lies or dies. Since when were women God's equals? I mean, they are not even equal to men, and now they think they are on the same level as God? Religion kills people. People kill people. God hates it.

Here is how I look at it. It is the most common sense way to look at it;

Sex costs money and responsibility. If you don't want to get pregnant or can't handle the responsibility of a child, close your legs. Remain abstenant. Don't make an innocent child, unborn or able to survive outside the womb, pay for the stupidity you exercise.

Women, wake up! Think! It wasn't that long ago that we barely had any freedom at all. We had sufferage at the hands of selfishness, and now, you women want to turn the tides and be selfish?! Don't abuse your rights. Let's use our rights for more positive things--not murder and selfishness.

freestyler105, I have no problems with you disagreeing with me, and it is fine you got pissed. I just don't like murdering. Not to mention, you need to find better grounds for a debate than launching personal attacks at people. This, to me, is not great evidence and makes for a very flimsy argument. What's more, it is less credible than the sources I thus stated above.

Where is your evidence and proof? No, I'm not being taunting. I just want to know. I'm genuinely interested in what you have to say. Like I said, I'll listen to your side. I'm all ears. It is about being mature adults here.
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Old 03-15-2008, 07:31 PM   #56
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Default Re: Presidential Elections!

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Originally Posted by troy View Post
McCain. He's not my first choice as a republican candidate, but he's all we've got so I'm going with him. Obama is too inexperienced and can only say the word "change." He wants to change, but doesn't seem to offer too many details. He's an alright guy and I'd take him over Clinton, but I don't trust him running the country. I don't like or trust Clinton and would never support her. She and her husband already had 8 years in the white house, we don't need any more Clintons in there.
I also don't want a president who will continue the Bush administration policies, I want someone who can create their own path and think for themselves instead of riding on the policies of the old administration. Those policies are what got us into this mess.
Idk if someone has said this, but I like your ideas. If I could vote, I would vote for Obama. McCain isn't THAT bad, but still, I would be reluctant to vote for a Republican.
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Old 03-15-2008, 07:33 PM   #57
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Default Re: Presidential Elections!

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Originally Posted by Waldorf PC View Post
freestyler105, yeah, what do you consider to be credible? I've heard all of the debates. I've researched each candidate thoroughly. I've stayed on top of every news station. I've visited their sites. I've listened to interviews. I've listened to Obama speak, and like I said, he can only say change change change change. Wow! A toddler can say more. He has no sense of direction. I'd like to know why you think he is qualified for the job other than the fact he is above the age of thirty-five.

If you can tell me, I'll listen to you. Everyone has a fair say.

I'm truly sorry that my post pissed you off. But, can you please tell me where it is right to take a baby who can clearly live outside the womb, rip it's limbs off while it is screaming and crying, puncturing the skul and sucking the brains out of it's head, leaving it in an unsanitary storage room to rot until death, drowning it, crushing it's skull, or other barbaric torturous and inhumane killing methods?

and you call this a choice?

A choice?

No, it is murder!!!!!!!!!

It is disgusting!

It is barbaric!

These women should die and be forced to suffer the same pain!!!!!!!!!!

You put a DOG out of it's misery better than that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What is the price on human life these days? It's pretty cheap it seems.

I won't vote for a barbarian!

And, MacGirl, thanks for coming to my defense.

freestyler105, I have no problems with you disagreeing with me, and it is fine you got pissed. I just don't like murdering.
Do you seriously think that that is how an abortion is done? This proves your ignorance... Since that is NOT what an abortion is, then your argument is pointless.
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Old 03-15-2008, 08:03 PM   #58
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Idk if someone has said this, but I like your ideas. If I could vote, I would vote for Obama. McCain isn't THAT bad, but still, I would be reluctant to vote for a Republican.
Thanks. I'm reluctant to really support either one of them. I usually support Republicans but I'm still a bit leary of McCain, if he chooses the right VP I'll definitely support him but I'm looking at Obama. I'll probably support McCain but I'm very hesitant to do so. With Obama there's the issue of inexperience and he seems to want to change the nation's direction awfully quick. I'm not sure if the US can handle too much change at once. Also what about the kinds of changes he is proposing? He really isn't too specific on that. Change is good, but that last time the nation was eager for change we got Carter along with an economic crisis, an energy crisis and a hostage crisis in Iran for over a year. That all happened within his one term he served as president.
On McCain there's the issue of his experience as well. The reason I say that is he has been in Washington for years now and has made some stupid decisions such as that immigration bill, and has made a lot of people angry. He also doesn't seem to have too much support from the hard core GOP voters which are a decent amount. I don't think he's a conservative, if he is one he's pretty moderate except on foreign policy and economic issues. The drawback of McCain is that he will most likely continue with the Bush administration policies which many people agree have failed and will only hurt us if they continue. Just because you're a republican doesn't mean you have to carry out those policies and I want a president who can make their own policies without copying the previous administration's failed policies.
What I want in a president is common sense, not a republican or democrat name tag. I want a president who can get these tasks done in a manner everyone will agree on:
  • Cut govt. spending and eliminate useless departments
  • find a way to get us out of Iraq without surrender
  • Fix our broken economy
  • Stop our dependence on foreign oil
  • Find a way to provide at least basic healthcare to children and senior citizens. Also a plan for working people that is affordable and is not universal nor will raise taxes
  • Cut wasteful spending in Washington and stop earmarks
  • Stop policing the world, as Reagan said "Trust but verify" maybe we should start using that philosophy instead of staying in Iraq and policing their country. We're spending money on this war but we can't even keep our own economy afloat and people here are suffering in turn.
  • Deal with China by making peace and becoming strong allies. They're growing faster than us and have a better educated population. Their military is also bigger. We should try not to engage in conflicts with them, but instead try to become strong allies with them and use our power for GOOD instead of looking for oil and policing the world
As for the abortion issue, I don't support it. I don't want to engage in an in depth debate over it but I don't believe in it unless it is in cases of incest or rape, or the baby will have a disorder that keeps it from living a normal and healthy life. I think it's wrong but each side has a justifiable opinion on this and I don't see an abortion amendment happening anytime soon.
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Old 03-15-2008, 08:20 PM   #59
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Default Re: Presidential Elections!

Quote:
3. she is a woman, and as far as I'm concerned, women should not be rulers. Men were made to be heads.
dude thats pretty F**** up
a woman would do just as good if not better then any other of our presidents

you say that oboma is connected to communism yet you follow close behind if thats true. this country was based on the freedom of any sex or race to do as they please including running this country
i will not have sexist or racist comments on this forum so please keep any thing that undermines or offends women or people of another race to your self
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Old 03-15-2008, 08:21 PM   #60
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Lightbulb Re: Presidential Elections!

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Do you seriously think that that is how an abortion is done? This proves your ignorance... Since that is NOT what an abortion is, then your argument is pointless.


My ignorance?

Are you familiar with the story of the nurs who discovered th baby at Christ Hospital in IL?

Do you know he acul definitionof PARTIAL BIRTH ABORTION, and can you tell me where it is humane?

Do you know the facts?

Here is some facts about abortion that you REALLY should look upon before assuming I'm ignorant. Then, I want to hear YOUR side of things. Please, I ask you to tell me how YOU think an abortion goes. Please find me some credible sources that I can read. I'm a very reasonable and open person.

www.lifedynamics.com/DeathCamps/Methods.cfm (Types of abortion, pictures of fetus & facts on abortion procedures)

www.lifesitenews.com/abortiontypes/

www.readthetruth.com/abortion-methods.htm

www.abortioninfo.net/facts/whatis2.shtml (Good old fashion scientific evidence.)

www.prolife.com/ABORMETH.html

www.abortionfacts.com/techniques/techniques.asp

Watch the video, Silent Scream. It will change your mind. It can be found here at www.silentscream.org/
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