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Old 09-16-2008, 05:39 PM   #41
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Default Re: *Now* I understand McCain and Palin

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Originally Posted by DJ-CHRIS View Post
Nobody is really jealous of the US, besides third world country's.
That's a hard generalization to make because the poor classes of 3rd world countries really want their country to be like the US so they can have a better lifestyle. Middle class really depends on the person. In Brazil our family was ranked middle-upper class and we were in no way jealous of the US. My dad came here because he's always wanted to work here, however he is regretting the job he took right now. He does not want to work for the government anymore (research center). But that's beside the point. Lastly, upper classes aren't really jealous of anything; after all they're in good condition.
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Old 09-17-2008, 10:58 AM   #42
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Default Re: *Now* I understand McCain and Palin

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That's a hard generalization to make because the poor classes of 3rd world countries really want their country to be like the US so they can have a better lifestyle.
I dunno, I went to the US seven years ago and didn't envy peoples' lifestyles there to be absolutely honest. Sure, things were cheap but this was because your average American doesn't have as much money or disposable income as your average European.

I would disapprove of being left to die on a hospital trolley after being shot for dropping litter because hospital administrators were bitching about my medical insurance, or having to buy substandard food and clothes at cheap prices which aren't even that cheap when you consider the lower value of the dollar and lower US salaries on average.

I also found the housing in the midwest to be of piss-poor quality and this was when staying with my "middle class" relatives. I have never envied the US lifestyle, what with hot weather, ugly cars, crappy housing, terrible healthcare system, sensationalist media, paranoid fear of the arbitrary terrorist bogeyman, and low salaries.
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Old 09-17-2008, 12:41 PM   #43
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Default Re: *Now* I understand McCain and Palin

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The US hasn't even really touched the main terrorism hubs much at all, that being Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and Iran. That's one thing we agree on!

From the Iraqi perspective, would you like it if someone invaded your country and overthrew your government and changed your life? I highly doubt you would like it. Also, the invasion of Iraq sparked a civil war in Iraq as well as some ethnic cleansing. After the military defeat of Iraq, the place turned to crap pretty quickly. Now you can see why a lot of people in Iraq are anti-American.
I hardly think any Iraqi citizen is sorry Saddam is gone, and I haven't seen any recent polls that would indicate that the Iraqi population is currently anti-American, but I would love to see a link or an article if you have one. We will pull most of the troops out of Iraq soon enough, I am sure we will keep bases there and keep them fully staffed with troops on a long term scale, but the pull out will take years not weeks or months as some people would think.

Chronicle of the atrocities committed by Saddam Hussein:

Hussein's regime killed, tortured, raped and terrorized the Iraqi people and its neighbors for over two decades.

Hundreds of thousands of people died as a result of Saddam's actions.

Saddam had approximately 40 of his own relatives murdered.

1980-88: Iran-Iraq war left 150,000 to 340,000 Iraqis and 450,000 to 730,000 Iranians dead.

1983-1988: Documented chemical attacks by Iraqi regime caused some 30,000 Iraqi and Iranian deaths.

1988: Chemical attack on Kurdish village of Halabja killed approximately 5,000 people.

1987-1988: Iraqi regime used chemical agents in attacks against at least 40 Kurdish villages.

1990-91: 1,000 Kuwaitis were killed in Iraqi invasion of Kuwait.

1991: Bloody suppression of Kurdish and Shi'a uprisings in northern and southern Iraq killed at least 30,000 to 60,000. At least 2,000 Kurdish villages were destroyed during the campaign of terror.

2001: Amnesty International report: "Victims of torture in Iraq are subjected to a wide range of forms of torture, including the gouging out of eyes, severe beatings and electric shocks... some victims have died as a result and many have been left with permanent physical and psychological damage."

Human Rights Watch: Saddam's 1987-1988 campaign of terror against the Kurds killed at least 50,000 and possibly as many as 100,000 Kurds.

Refugees International: "Oppressive government policies have led to the internal displacement of 900,000 Iraqis."

Iraq's 13 million Shiite Muslims, the majority of Iraq's population of approximately 22 million, faced severe restrictions on their religious practice.

FBI: Iraqi government was involved in a plot to assassinate former President George Bush during his April 14-16, 1993, visit to Kuwait.

The Iraqi regime has repeatedly refused visits by human rights monitors.

From 1992 until 2002, Saddam prevented the U.N. Special Rapporteur from visiting Iraq.

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Old 09-17-2008, 02:09 PM   #44
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Default Re: *Now* I understand McCain and Palin

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Were in no way jealous of you at all. We like being Canadian and virtually all of us are very proud of it. Nobody is really jealous of the US, besides third world country's.

Also, invading Iraq did not help eliminate "terrorism". The people of Iraq were fairly neutral and not hostile towards the US, and there was little to no links of terrorism. What it really did was create hostility towards the US from the entire middle eastern region, as even Iraq's enemy's now hate the US more than ever. The US hasn't even really touched the main terrorism hubs much at all, that being Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and Iran.

From the Iraqi perspective, would you like it if someone invaded your country and overthrew your government and changed your life? I highly doubt you would like it. Also, the invasion of Iraq sparked a civil war in Iraq as well as some ethnic cleansing. After the military defeat of Iraq, the place turned to crap pretty quickly. Now you can see why a lot of people in Iraq are anti-American.
most of the irq's are with the new way of life. even though they cannot get along with their relgion problems iraq is better offwithout saddam. all the prolems lie with the fact that the shiites and the suunis cannot get along and that the religious extermists keep attacking the americans. one thing i think the next president should do either obama or mcain or palin , they should have the iraq's government have a vote of wether or not they want us in or out or just keep a small police/milatary training force their.
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Old 09-17-2008, 03:33 PM   #45
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Default Re: *Now* I understand McCain and Palin

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most of the irq's are with the new way of life. even though they cannot get along with their relgion problems iraq is better offwithout saddam. all the prolems lie with the fact that the shiites and the suunis cannot get along and that the religious extermists keep attacking the americans. one thing i think the next president should do either obama or mcain or palin , they should have the iraq's government have a vote of wether or not they want us in or out or just keep a small police/milatary training force their.
They already said they want you out.

And yeah, Saddam was not very well liked by the Iraqi people and did do alot of bad things, but that doesn't mean they wanted to be "liberated"
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Old 09-17-2008, 10:00 PM   #46
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Default Re: *Now* I understand McCain and Palin

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I dunno, I went to the US seven years ago and didn't envy peoples' lifestyles there to be absolutely honest. Sure, things were cheap but this was because your average American doesn't have as much money or disposable income as your average European.

===> I'm proud to be an American and I think your wrong for your are definitely over generalizing that the Average American doesn't have much money or disposable income. Money isn't everything.

I would disapprove of being left to die on a hospital trolley after being shot for dropping litter because hospital administrators were bitching about my medical insurance
====>Give a link to where that happen and I'll bet I could find something on your country or worse, which I'm not going to do for I sure the U.K. is a great country to visit as I'm sure there are other great countries worth visiting.

, or having to buy substandard food and clothes at cheap prices which aren't even that cheap when you consider the lower value of the dollar and lower US salaries on average.

+++> Also I take it your from the UK and if my memory serves me right you have or had Mad Cow Disease so I wouldn't be throwing stones at Glass Houses on the "Substandard" food issue.

I also found the housing in the midwest to be of piss-poor quality and this was when staying with my "middle class" relatives. I have never envied the US lifestyle, what with hot weather ===Snow is hot weather in the Midwest?, ugly cars ===> Ugly Cars compared to what? , crappy housing ===> Broad Statement and your opinion which I could careless about, terrible health care system ===> Don't you have Socialized Medicine which in my opinion is one of the worse forms of medicine, sensationalist media, paranoid fear of the arbitrary terrorist bogeyman ====> Let's see the last terrorist attack I recalling that happen in your country the police did a thing called shoot first ask questions later ...yeap that is the country I want to live in , and low salaries ===> what do you consider?
Don't get me wrong the United States has it share of problems and while I'll probably vote for McCain/Palin because I'm a conservative which makes mean lean towards the Republican Party I will still be proud of my country if Obama/Biden wins. I think us Americans make terrific looking cars, we have good housing and while times are tough right now I think the majority of Americans will pull through and be even stronger than before. I personally think there's nothing wrong with most other countries (even yours) in the world, I'm feel privileged to born in and to live in this Great Country!
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Old 09-17-2008, 10:15 PM   #47
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Default Re: *Now* I understand McCain and Palin

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Nobody is really jealous of the US, besides third world country's.
There's absolutely no need for personal attacks against any nation. You've already voiced your opinion on the United States. There's no need to further emphasize it.

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I have never envied the US lifestyle, what with hot weather...
You've never envied Californian weather?

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...crappy housing...
California has one of the strictest building codes and regulations in the world. Crappy housing doesn't cut it here.
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Old 09-17-2008, 10:25 PM   #48
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Default Re: *Now* I understand McCain and Palin


lol
you cant really tell, but the guys in a wheel chair
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Old 09-17-2008, 10:50 PM   #49
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Default Re: *Now* I understand McCain and Palin

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They already said they want you out.

And yeah, Saddam was not very well liked by the Iraqi people and did do alot of bad things, but that doesn't mean they wanted to be "liberated"
Did you miss the majority of the Iraqi's saying they wanted us there???
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Old 09-18-2008, 01:10 AM   #50
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Default Re: *Now* I understand McCain and Palin

I'm confused does the Iraqi's want us there or was that a joke?
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