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Old 05-31-2006, 09:56 AM   #1
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Default Massacre in Iraq

In starting this thread, I am fully aware that it is a very contentious subject, so, please, discussion only, no arguments, if there are, & I think they are getting getting out of hand,I will lock this thread.
As CF has a lot of US members, their comments will be interesting, but all join in, there will, of course be conflicting views, but keep your cool, no political or racial ranting please, I have got my own views on this, I may reveal them later, as the posts grow, but don't ask me beforehand, I simply won't be drawn, fair enough?
Facts, [so-called]; Allegedly twenty Iraqi's killed, men women & children, the youngest a two year old girl, I say allegedly, but apparently a named Marine was a witness, not of the killing, but of the aftermath, it's all over British TV, the blood, the wrapped bodies, the many bullet-holes in the interior walls etc. I hope that other countries are as liberal with their TV footage, as they are here.
No doubt one of the main issues discussed will be the length between the alleged incident, & yesterday's exposure, they are constantly updating reports on this at Google news, it's well worth a look, note, no smilies here, this is a serious subject, so no cries of "Wow, cool, man!" or the like, I've seen it before on serious subjects, so no idiots, OK?
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Old 05-31-2006, 10:12 AM   #2
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Default Re: Massacre in Iraq

Stuff like this makes me sick. There's no humor in this at all, killing innocent people is wrong and the people who do it don't deserve to live. I hope if they find out who did it they set them up infront of a firing squad.
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Old 05-31-2006, 10:23 AM   #3
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Default Re: Massacre in Iraq

Thats horrible it really is, Dang the iraqis why did they do it?
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Old 05-31-2006, 10:39 AM   #4
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Default Re: Massacre in Iraq

Quote:
Originally Posted by natej315
Thats horrible it really is, Dang the iraqis why did they do it?
I think you misread. There were Iraqis that were killed, Presumably by american soldiers
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Old 05-31-2006, 10:50 AM   #5
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Default Re: Massacre in Iraq

The United States Response:
Quote:
Originally Posted by smh.com.au
Speaking for the first time on the alleged massacre of civilians, including women and children, by US marines, Mr Maliki said that killings had to be investigated and civilians protected.

"We emphasise that our forces, that multinational forces will respect … the rights of the Iraqi citizen," he said. "It is not justifiable that a family is killed because someone is fighting terrorists. We have to be more specific and more careful." Mr Maliki also said: "We are worried about the increase in 'mistakes'."
Dispicable. These Marines have a craving for murder, It is how they are trained. (Believe me, it's true) They are just going to let them sit over there, waiting, with a loaded gun.. It's not right, They need to bring these troops back to America. This "Mistake" as they call it was no more than some buddies getting revenge. I'm not saying that it is right that marine to have been killed, But good god. Innocent lives..

Quote:
Originally Posted by smh.com.au

More detailed reports are emerging of what happened in Haditha on the November day after a marine was killed by a roadside bomb. A dozen marines then rampaged through houses nearby, killing the occupants in front of their traumatised children. Some of these children were also killed, while others managed to survive by fleeing or pretending to be dead.

Four university students in a taxi were also killed, despite pleas for mercy from the taxi driver, according to witnesses.

This incident may not be the end of the allegations of wrongdoing by US forces in Haditha.
It personally makes my heart ache thinking about all those people. Specifically the children.. Can you immagine? We shouldn't be over there.

I know you said not to express political ranting, But the ONLY reason Our President has our troops over there is in hopes of gaining personal profit off of the oil he can find in Iraq, and the military oppertunity to "keep an eye" on Iran.

It's just horrible

You can get one of the latest articles on the incident here:
http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/us-...956417430.html

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Old 05-31-2006, 10:52 AM   #6
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Default Re: Massacre in Iraq

Quote:
Originally Posted by natej315
Thats horrible it really is, Dang the iraqis why did they do it?
Reading the article below found on BBC news it has been suggested that it is not the Iraqis that carried out this atrocity, it is indicated that the initial story was that of a road side bomb. I would suggest reading the story below;

Massacre in Iraq

As the story indicates it has now changed to the civilians being caught up in a firefight with insurgents, and were shot by US Marines.

To comment on whether I believe this or not, would mean to discuss my views on the war as an overall view and I am not prepared to do this. Whatever has happened I do believe that there will be very little chance of the truth coming out, as to do so would involve both the UK and US government being open which I feel is something that there is little chance to happen.

For families and children to be massacred like this just shows the depravities which human beings are prepared to go to against fellow man. It personally disgusts me, and makes me wonder that unless there is some major changes what it will be like for our kids in the future.

The story will certainly incite further hatred against the US and if there is fact behind the story then I can certainly understand why. However I cannot comment on why, being in a warzone drastically affects the state of mind of the soldiers out there, a goverment which forces them over there for capital gain and then fails to provide the appropriate equipment, intelligence and resources to do their job all have a negative affect.

None of us who have not been in the service imo can comment on the why's and therefores but I think we can all recognise that it is not appropriate for any individual to act in that manner, whether they be US, UK or Iraqi and massacre human beings like has been done.

Its yet another sad day among a number of sad days and atrocities on a daily basis.

On a side note, it is interesting that this war has become the most dangerous for journalists whereas before they have always been under some sort form of protection, now it appears that it is anything goes for anyone in that country.

I have to ask myself, why our countries are out there, and please do not tell me that its because of the atrocities that Saddam has carried out, because there are hundreds of small countries that their people are being persecuted but we are not carrying out military actions over there.
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Old 05-31-2006, 10:55 AM   #7
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Default Re: Massacre in Iraq

definitly not cool... and I should imagine that this was infact just a grave mistake made by someone, (probably just a kid of 18), who made an error of judgement.
there's been a reasonable amount of 'mistakes' that have been made...

in fact heres an extract from todays papers.
Quote:
Iraqis 'are tired of US mistakes'
THE Iraqi prime minister said yesterday that he was tired of hearing US army excuses that civillians were being killed by 'mistake'.
Nuri al-Maliki's comments came as he announced plans to investigate the deaths of 24 Iraqis at Haditha last year.
"Yes, a mistake may happen but there are acceptable limits to mistakes." he said when asked about a US investigation into the killings in the western town last november.
"We are worried about an increase in 'mistakes'. I am not saying that they are intentional. But it is worrying for us." The newly confirmed leader said that the government would also investigate other civillian deaths.
"we will ask for answers not only about Haditha but about any opperation in which killing happeed by mistake, and we will hold those who did it responsible.".
US defence officials have said charges, incuding murder, could be brought against marines following the investigation...
the article goes on... and later includes the words...
Quote:
The case emerged when locals gave footage of the bnodies to international media. US lawyers briefed by officials agree with local witnesses who claim marines shot civillians...
indeed it seems that killing people is not a crime that will go unpunished. I think the trouble is that there are so many people who believe that the soldiers are there for the greater good of the Iraqi people that everyone would object to paying any kind of fines or repetition for the accidental murder whilst soldiers are efffectivly just trying to do their jobs!

I think there has already been too much friendly fire where people are getting killed by stray bullets that are being fired when the firer, (obviously) hasn't got the confidence, the training, or the knowledge to see the dirrerence between an enemy soldier, or an ally solider, or even a civillian.

Of course, as anyone willing to stick up for the army would rightly say.

if these supposably innocent civillians wern't harbouring fugatives and militants in their houses and neighbourhoods then the fighting could happen way out in the middle of nowhere where it is meant to happen.
if it weren't for the bad iraqis hidding behind the good iraqis, the good people of iraq would have no fears, and no troubles!
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Old 05-31-2006, 10:57 AM   #8
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Default Re: Massacre in Iraq

What happened anyways? I think I heard something about this on the radio yesterday, but I don't even know the situation.
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Old 05-31-2006, 10:59 AM   #9
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Default Re: Massacre in Iraq

I get your points, but how was it a mistake? The Marines just went and mutilized civilians out of anger of their loss. Those Marines make close bonds with each other, One gets killed.. And It's like animal instict almost.
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Old 05-31-2006, 11:03 AM   #10
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Default Re: Massacre in Iraq

I think the point is that mistakes are made...

I think the only way that we can relate to this is in a sort of school yard way, I mean imagine that someone throws something at you, and when you turn around you see someone laughing. well you immediatly assume it's them that did it.

well the soldiers are seeing their friends being blown appart by bombs and then seeing people cheer and make light of the fact that your buddy's been killed, it could be a case of mistaken identity or bad inteligece...

or it could have just been a mistake to put the solidaers out there in the first place.
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