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Old 04-10-2008, 01:17 AM   #1
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Exclamation Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Q6600.
Tuniq Tower.
Great Airflow throughout case.


What do you guys think my only problem is right now?

Ambient Air Temperatures!


The Tuniq Tower is doing a great job at keeping things cool during the day, but at night, when the whole house is being heated, my lights are on and my window is closed, the temperature in my room can get hot. As in, 27-29*C hot. And I KNOW that has a profound effect on what I can do as far as overclocking goes.


Here's what I'm currently at:

@ 2800MHz, computer ran beautifully with 1.2125V Vcore.
@ 3000MHz, computer ran beautifully with 1.2750V Vcore.
@ 3200MHz, computer requires somewhere around 1.3500 Vcore, and is not stable.

At 3200Mhz, I raised the VCore to 1.3500V to see if it would become any more stable (P95 kept causing blue screen hangs and random restarts, and sometimes even errors, too.) So I raised it to 1.3500V, and not only were my temperatures hovering around 63-64*C (CoreTemp, might be 4-5* too high, hmm), but it also crashed and I got a BSOD dump/restart after starting firefox while the test was running.

I've returned the computer to 3000MHz and am running fine. I'll leave P95 on overnight to test the stability again, but I'm sorta bummed that I'm not able to use my Tuniq to its full potential because of my room temperatures.

I want to hear your thoughts/advice.


Chris
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Old 04-10-2008, 01:43 AM   #2
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Can't you cover up the heater vent and open the window?
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Old 04-10-2008, 03:51 AM   #3
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cabbspapp View Post
Can't you cover up the heater vent and open the window?
I knew I'd get questions like that:

The heater vent is already covered but the whole house is being heated anyway, so it eventually warms up my room, too. Leaving my window open makes it uncomfortably cold for me at night since my bed is against the window.
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Old 04-10-2008, 05:23 AM   #4
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

What you wanna do is make an hole in the wall for an air duct to an outside wall. Get some flex tubing, 80mm, and connect to the intake fan on the computer. Have the computer sucking in cold air from outside.

I had this set up at my mums house. Excellent in the winter and pretty good in the summer evenings.

You might have to re-arrange your room to connect the computer to the ducting which goes to the hole in the wall.
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Old 04-10-2008, 06:37 AM   #5
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

What are you other voltages set at. Auto isn't that great for overclocking, and you will need a 1.6V CPU PLL voltage and a 1.4V FSB termination voltage. Also, disable CPU spread spectrum and PCI-E spread spectrum.
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Old 04-10-2008, 01:31 PM   #6
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Remeniz View Post
What you wanna do is make an hole in the wall for an air duct to an outside wall. Get some flex tubing, 80mm, and connect to the intake fan on the computer. Have the computer sucking in cold air from outside.

I had this set up at my mums house. Excellent in the winter and pretty good in the summer evenings.

You might have to re-arrange your room to connect the computer to the ducting which goes to the hole in the wall.
but what about condensation?
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Old 04-10-2008, 02:07 PM   #7
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

I never had a problem with condensation.

When I set this up the fan drawing in the cold air was temperature controlled and to be honest was only on during the warmer months.

I modded an old cream coloured tower and had the duct connected to the lower front of the case. It worked a treat and I ended up sell the Gigabyte GA-7ZXR mobo, with the thunderbird CPU, in working condition on eBay.
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Old 04-10-2008, 03:18 PM   #8
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Remeniz View Post
What you wanna do is make an hole in the wall for an air duct to an outside wall. Get some flex tubing, 80mm, and connect to the intake fan on the computer. Have the computer sucking in cold air from outside.

I had this set up at my mums house. Excellent in the winter and pretty good in the summer evenings.

You might have to re-arrange your room to connect the computer to the ducting which goes to the hole in the wall.
I toyed with that same exact idea after I realized that ambient temperatures were gonna be a problem. I was gonna poke a hole in my wall and use PVC piping I had left over from my car intake project to route colder air to my computer air ducts. Two problems:

1. I don't want to poke a hole in my wall.
2. I wouldn't like the look of a pipe taped up to my computer. My room is totally clean and aesthetics are too important to me since I have people in my room all the time.

I've thought about another idea and tested it last night, too.

My computer sits on top of my desk, which is arguably the hottest section of my room because of the monitor heat, lamps, etc. I placed two thermometers near my desk area; one near the computer and another UNDERNEATH my desk. I found a 7*F difference. I don't know if that's a huge difference or not, but I'm thinking that a simple relocation of the computer could technically help me with the heat issues at the height of the night wen temps are so high for me.

I'm predicting that summer will actually be a friendly welcome to my overclocking adventures. I know my logic goes against what every other person says about overclocking, but I see no reason to dread summer. In my house, the heater is always on during Winter, causing ambient temps to be ridiculously high. But during Summer, my AC will be constantly running and my room temperature will be much lower than what it is right now.

Anyway, I'll be trying the location switch tonite and will keep you guys updated.


Quote:
Originally Posted by worshipme View Post
What are you other voltages set at. Auto isn't that great for overclocking, and you will need a 1.6V CPU PLL voltage and a 1.4V FSB termination voltage. Also, disable CPU spread spectrum and PCI-E spread spectrum.
Worshipme, I've changed quite a lot through the BIOS, and have disabled a lot of features. When I get home I'll go ahead and take pictures of all my settings and i'll post them up. Hopefully you can chime in again.

As per my last post, here are the pics of my BIOS settings.










Hopefully there's something we can mess around with to help me a litte. I relocated my computer tower to the coolest location in this room and the temperatures are still the same.
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Old 04-11-2008, 08:04 PM   #9
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Got your PM.
As you said in your first post that you couldn't get it stable at 3.2GHz, I can tell you that I didn't need any more than a 1.35V vcore, but I did need to fiddle with a few other settings.

PCIE frequency: When overclocking, always set this to 100MHz, as you never know whether your GPU will be able to handle the higher frequencies and it may limit your CPU. Afterwards, when your CPU overclock is stable, you can increase this to try and get a little extra performance from your PCI-E cards.

DRAM frequency: You will need to set this manually otherwise your RAM may be running at higher speeds and causing instability and therefore limiting your OC. Use a 1:1 memory divider here. You can fine tune after to get your RAM to it's max speed.

DRAM command rate/DRAM timing control: When set to auto, your BIOS will most likely relax these settings slightly, so I prefer to enter them manually according to my RAM specs. Select manual and enter your timings in the first four. Command rate should be 2T.

CPU Vcore: Like I said previously, the Q6600 G0 shouldn't need anymore than 1.35V to reach 3.2GHz.

CPU PLL voltage: Here, I could run at around 3.3GHz with 1.5V, but increasing the FSB further required 1.7V. It may be that your Q6600 needs a little bit more juice than mine, so I would up that to 1.7.

FSB termination voltage: The higher you go FSB wise, the more juice you need. I run a 400FSB with 1.4V, so 1.3V should be sufficient but if you experience instability, up it to the next notch.

DRAM voltage: Nominal voltage for Corsair XMS2 is 2.1V.

NB voltage: Your BIOS looks a lot like mine, so you should have a 1.4V option, use this when the FSB speed is over 350 or you are trying to squeeze some extra bandwidth from your RAM.

SB voltage: My BIOS doesn't have this option so unfortunately I can't help you here.

CPU spread spectrum/PCIE spread spectrum: Supposed to eliminate electromagnetic interference but can mess with frequencies slightly, enough to cause instability so disable both of these two.

All other options are fine on auto and shouldn't have any impact on your overclocking.

BTW, what motherboard do you have? I'm guessing ASUS P5K deluxe...
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Old 04-12-2008, 06:24 AM   #10
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

I've got the P5K-E actually. And wow, I forgot it supports 45nm chips. Woooo.

Worship me, as per your instructions I've gone ahead and overclocked my computer again to 3204MHz. We'll see how hot this baby gets and whether or not it'll stay stable. I'll keep you posted.
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Old 04-12-2008, 09:30 AM   #11
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

I also found out about an interesting mod you can do on the P5Ks. It involves a 2B pencil and is supposed to reduce and almost eliminate vdroop which is a big problem on the P5Ks, just a few strokes will do:

I'm going to try it out on mine as I've been having real trouble with vdroop.
I'm almost certain it's the same for the P5K-E as well.
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Old 04-12-2008, 03:05 PM   #12
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Alrighty, so at 3204MHz and a 1.365VCore, and after 8 hours of P95, I've gotten no errors and system is extremely stable...

...in the hottest room ever. My max temps were:

65*
63*
60*
60*

measured with RealTemp. Too hot for my taste, but I don't know what to do.

Worshipme, do you think these are okay temperatures? Should I keep it here or what? Technically how often is my computer gonna see a full 100% load for this to be a problem?

And also, does that P5K mod have anything to do with reducing heat? I can't figure out what's actually happening in the picture either.
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Old 04-12-2008, 04:11 PM   #13
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Quote:
Worshipme, do you think these are okay temperatures? Should I keep it here or what? Technically how often is my computer gonna see a full 100% load for this to be a problem?
They do seem quite high for a Tuniq Tower and a 1.365V vcore. I'm getting those load temps at 1.45V. But then that's because your ambient temps are higher than mine.
What I think you should do is check how flat the base of your heatsink and CPU IHS are, just use a razor blade and hold it up to a light. If you see uneven light coming through, then it's not flat. In that case you will see a decent drop from lapping.
Quote:
And also, does that P5K mod have anything to do with reducing heat? I can't figure out what's actually happening in the picture either.
Since a lower vcore will be required because of the reduced vdroop, it could result in slightly lower temps. I'm going to do the mod right now.
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Old 04-12-2008, 04:21 PM   #14
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by worshipme View Post
They do seem quite high for a Tuniq Tower and a 1.365V vcore. I'm getting those load temps at 1.45V. But then that's because your ambient temps are higher than mine.
What I think you should do is check how flat the base of your heatsink and CPU IHS are, just use a razor blade and hold it up to a light. If you see uneven light coming through, then it's not flat. In that case you will see a decent drop from lapping.

Since a lower vcore will be required because of the reduced vdroop, it could result in slightly lower temps. I'm going to do the mod right now.

Alright keep me posted as to what you actually had to do (physically) for the P5K mod. I still don't understand what the mod itself is.


As far as temperatures go, I sure hope its my ambient temps that are screwing it up. I'd rather not have any problems at all obviously, but I'd hate to think that my Tuniq doesn't have a perfectly even surface. I honestly don't want to take out all my components again, although its not THAT big of a PITA.

I'm gonna try 1.35VCore now.
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Old 04-12-2008, 04:48 PM   #15
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GhostGT View Post
Alrighty, so at 3204MHz and a 1.365VCore, and after 8 hours of P95, I've gotten no errors and system is extremely stable...

...in the hottest room ever. My max temps were:

65*
63*
60*
60*

measured with RealTemp. Too hot for my taste, but I don't know what to do.

Worshipme, do you think these are okay temperatures? Should I keep it here or what? Technically how often is my computer gonna see a full 100% load for this to be a problem?

And also, does that P5K mod have anything to do with reducing heat? I can't figure out what's actually happening in the picture either.
see the little yellow piece, you rub a pencil over it to leave an electrially conductive layer of graphite on it so the path of least resistance is via the graphite which increases the flow thus reducing vdroop. Some people then cover this with clear nail polish to stop the graphite wearing off. Also ensure you get the mod specific to your board if you do this as the voltage regulator location varies from model to model.

Couple of other things from your bios screenie.

Memory remap does nothing with 32bit os, set to disable

Manually set your:

cpu ratio to 8 (set it to 9 if you want to try for 3.6GHz)
strap to 400 (use 200 if the DDR2-800 option is not available in DRAM Frequency)
FSB to 400
PCIE Frequency to 100
DRAM Frequenciy to DDR2-800
DRAM Command rate to 1T or 1N (this depends a lot on your memory, if it is rated to run at 4-4-4-12 then it should do so at 1T or 1N) if it doesn't then a combo of more voltage and/or looser timings needs to be found)
DRAM Timing Control - your memory should be able to run at 4-4-4-12 as above, leave the sub timings etc on auto
DRAM, NB, SB voltages, adjust as necessary to achieve stabitilty
Load Line Calibration, this is to combat vdroop, set to enabled (this actually works really well on my current board, on my P5K vanilla it didn't work at all.)
CPU and PCI spread spectrum, set to disable.

I would reenable C1E support and speedstep if it was me.

Your temps are highish but we know the cause, your room temp is the main factor here, unless you're running a 100% cpu usage applications then these should reduce when speedstep and C1E kick in at idle.

Nice voltage
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Old 04-12-2008, 05:05 PM   #16
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

OK, I have successfully modded my P5K, and I'm very happy with the results. I would recommend it to anyone who wants to overclock and has a P5K. Vcore set to 1.45V in BIOS, and before I was getting around 1.3V at full load, which is awful. Here are the results after the mod.
Voltage at idle:



As we can see from PC Wizard 2008. The vdroop is quite low at 0.02V.

And here is the vcore at load:



Not even the smallest drop! In fact, it increased slightly. I should be able to get it stable and a lower voltage now.


@ GhostGT, I found I couldn't get my Corsair memory to function at 1T timings. But you may have more luck. I'm currently running at 4-4-4-10.
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Old 04-12-2008, 05:09 PM   #17
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

in the first pic , its running at 2.2ghz , why is that .
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Old 04-12-2008, 05:12 PM   #18
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

Stepspeed. I have it enabled and I don't have any problems with it. As soon as my CPU has a bit of work to do, it switches the multiplier to 9 and it saves energy so, why not? I know some people have some problems with it whilst overclocking though.

EDIT: Seems to be perfectly stable at 1.4V. Going to try 1.375.
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Old 04-12-2008, 05:34 PM   #19
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Default Re: Project Overclock #2: Trouble in Paradise?

those are some seriously good reductions in vcore mate.
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Old 04-12-2008, 05:37 PM   #20
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How long before I will have to rub it again with the graphite? If it doesn't last long then I'll just apply the nail polish.
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