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Old 03-27-2005, 09:12 PM   #91
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Old 03-27-2005, 09:40 PM   #92
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Well if there weren't those who followed AMD in the times of darkness, there wouldn't be an AMD today. AMD was not always the best. And neither is Intel right now. People don't seem to understand that the AMD today was built on a series of failures and shortcomings. Someone who strives for more, like AMD, is going to catch up. Someone who is used to winning all the time, like Intel (Or Nintendo and it's Gameboy) is just going to sit around assuming it can win by default.

And needforspeed, I had seen that benchmark too. I don't really feel that the NetBurst architecture can openly compete. Like I've said before, the P4 competed with the XP. Intel failed to come up with a new chip to properly contend with the AMD64, and fell massively behind. The AMD64 is newer and more efficient. There are a lot of benchmarks out there that aren't biased, and to be honest when I see losses by the Pentium 4, I just think about the architecture and the processor itself. It simply isn't good enough.

Also, as far as the Turion is concerned, they haven't really disclosed a lot of information on it. Obviously AMD should be able to release something that can beat the Pentium M in regards to performance for several reasons. The first being that the Pentium M and Centrino platform wasn't designed with enthusiasts in mind. AMD has said they intend on advertising the performance of the Turion, unlike the Pentium M. Therefore the mindset is there, and AMD is planning on bringing performance, the kind of things we've come to expect from AMD, into the mobile market.

Also, the Pentium M isn't exactly new. It's already begun aging by now. If they release a new processor to compete it should, by default, step all over the Pentium M. The Pentium M doesn't even have SSE3 instructions. It wasn't built as a gaming processor, it was purely a coincidence. It made sense for the chip to focus on more clock cycles as opposed to longer pipelines and more core frequency because you want to conserve energy. While we wait patiently on the release of the Turion, you can rest assured that the multi-core Yonah has been planned for early 2006 for some time now as well. Which will be a 65nm aimed at the mobile market along with its supporting chipset Calistoga. I'm hoping for this:
Pentium M < Turion > Yonah < Matching AMD chip
I don't think I saw anything in the future for mobile chips in the roadmap for AMD, but those are always crap anyway. That's just how things should go, naturally.

EDIT: I also forgot. Has anyone heard about the chipset supporting the Turion? I'm interested to know about it.
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Old 03-27-2005, 09:50 PM   #93
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Default Re: New Extreme Edition - WTF!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SSE4
Well if there weren't those who followed AMD in the times of darkness, there wouldn't be an AMD today. AMD was not always the best. And neither is Intel right now. People don't seem to understand that the AMD today was built on a series of failures and shortcomings. Someone who strives for more, like AMD, is going to catch up. Someone who is used to winning all the time, like Intel (Or Nintendo and it's Gameboy) is just going to sit around assuming it can win by default.

I have to agree with that I know this from my experiences during College. What is interesting though; once he who is always used to winning realises he can't without doing something and pulls his socks up - beating that who has through his life strived constantly is not hard. Intel is only not so good now because of that. That is the beauty of competition; Intel could quite easily have just dropped to B, and AMD finally got A - it by no means means that Intel is going to loose, it just means they need to pull an A* out of the bag. It can happen

Quote:
Originally Posted by SSE4
And needforspeed, I had seen that benchmark too. I don't really feel that the NetBurst architecture can openly compete. Like I've said before, the P4 competed with the XP. Intel failed to come up with a new chip to properly contend with the AMD64, and fell massively behind. The AMD64 is newer and more efficient. There are a lot of benchmarks out there that aren't biased, and to be honest when I see losses by the Pentium 4, I just think about the architecture and the processor itself. It simply isn't good enough.

HT is good and all, and EM64T fills in for the lack of 64-bitting but you're probably right. The Prescott and Gallatin and so on just aren't AMD64-Level Processors, and still they beat it which should be amazing. Microsoft was in a similar position with the Internet at one point Caught with its trousers down as it were, I think we know where that went.

Don't think I'll comment on Mobile Chips Its all way off my view - I actually don't believe Mobile Chips are of any use. If I had to buy a Laptop, I'd get one with a proper Desktop Processor in it.
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Old 03-27-2005, 10:13 PM   #94
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Default Re: New Extreme Edition - WTF!!!

"still they beat it which should be amazing"

No they don't. I don't know what is so defective in your head... I just can't understand anymore.

Hey LK... stop and think. Please. Mobile processing is the fastest growing market right now. It outpaces desktops by quite a bit.
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Old 03-28-2005, 03:49 AM   #95
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Default Re: New Extreme Edition - WTF!!!

"The Prescott and Gallatin and so on just aren't AMD64-Level Processors, and still they beat it which should be amazing."

Lord Kalthorn, stop talking out of your ass. The Gallatin core is a server core, which means it is not that suitable for desktops, and the Prescott core was the worst thing which ever happen to Intel. If I was going to buy an Intel, I'd buy a Northwood. No question about it.

On the subject of mobile processors, if your gonna buy a laptop with a desktop processor in it, you have to have one hell of a big laptop bag, and it would need enough power to supply a damn fishing village. Also, it will way a ton. That's where mobile processors come in, as they use less power, are lighter, are quieter (come on, do you really want a laptop which sounds like a whirlwind) and most of all, as technology progresses, are getting better are more like desktop chips.

SSE4, your completely right. Intel have approached the 6-series wrong, as they have kept the NetBurst architecture and also the Prescott core. The 6-series should have been built to compete with the AMD 64s, but instead it just looks like a stop-gap until the dual-cores come out.

"Someone who strives for more, like AMD, is going to catch up. Someone who is used to winning all the time, like Intel (Or Nintendo and it's Gameboy) is just going to sit around assuming it can win by default."

That is the best sentence summing up Intel and AMD I have heard in a long time. AMD are now advertising, getting contracts, making better processors, and researching. Intel are just researching. That's it. I could imagine being in two rooms, one with AMD and one with Intel. In the AMD room, they would be furiously planning, but chatting and laughing at the same time. In the Intel room, everyone would be sitting in corner's staring out the windows, or watching TV. And if Intel don't buck up their ideas, AMD are easily going to over take them, just because AMD seem to care more about what they do.

I'm gonna say this again, but SSE4 has some of the most balanced arguments in this forum. True, he's an Intel supporter, but unlike Lord Kalthorn he really knows what he's talking about and he also is ready to admit that in some places Intel have gone wrong.
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Old 03-28-2005, 07:19 AM   #96
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Default Re: New Extreme Edition - WTF!!!

hp/compaq are like the only ones that are starting not to use intel and goto amd64 and pci-express.

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Originally Posted by Giancarlo
But it boils down to what is the better buy, and in every case AMD is the better more affordable buy. Why pay more for less or about the same? I don't get it. It is like Abercrombie and Old Navy. Hahah. And yes i have heard AMD is branching out to computer manufacturers now too..
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Old 03-28-2005, 10:39 AM   #97
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Default Re: New Extreme Edition - WTF!!!

Mesh sell both AMDs and Intels. It will be a happy day when AMD owns the pre-built computer market
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Old 03-28-2005, 04:42 PM   #98
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Default Re: New Extreme Edition - WTF!!!

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Originally Posted by zoomtm
hp/compaq are like the only ones that are starting not to use intel and goto amd64 and pci-express.
HPQ as it is called (since they merged) is a very large corporation... this is a big move, and huge success for AMD I believe.
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Old 03-28-2005, 06:22 PM   #99
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Default Re: New Extreme Edition - WTF!!!

Firstly; you sig is too long

Quote:
Originally Posted by needforspeed
"The Prescott and Gallatin and so on just aren't AMD64-Level Processors, and still they beat it which should be amazing."

Lord Kalthorn, stop talking out of your ass. The Gallatin core is a server core, which means it is not that suitable for desktops, and the Prescott core was the worst thing which ever happen to Intel. If I was going to buy an Intel, I'd buy a Northwood. No question about it.

Gallatin is the Core used in the 3.43 Extreme. Its the only reason the 3.43 gets so high compared to the Prescott; its a damn fine desktop core whether originally a Server one or not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by needforspeed
On the subject of mobile processors, if your gonna buy a laptop with a desktop processor in it, you have to have one hell of a big laptop bag, and it would need enough power to supply a damn fishing village. Also, it will way a ton. That's where mobile processors come in, as they use less power, are lighter, are quieter (come on, do you really want a laptop which sounds like a whirlwind) and most of all, as technology progresses, are getting better are more like desktop chips.

That doesn't bother me I carry around all my school books on the 2 mile walk and 40 mile train journey to College just so I don't have to pack in the morning. I'm a lazy bastard. Desktop chips are becomming more and more like Mobile Chips; in the end I imagine they'll both have the same Chips. But for now - Desktop Chips are cheaper, and faster.

Quote:
Originally Posted by needforspeed
SSE4, your completely right. Intel have approached the 6-series wrong, as they have kept the NetBurst architecture and also the Prescott core. The 6-series should have been built to compete with the AMD 64s, but instead it just looks like a stop-gap until the dual-cores come out.

Nothing wrong with a stopgap - recouperation is of great use when planning the death of your opponent following an unexpected yealding of land.

Quote:
Originally Posted by needforspeed
"Someone who strives for more, like AMD, is going to catch up. Someone who is used to winning all the time, like Intel (Or Nintendo and it's Gameboy) is just going to sit around assuming it can win by default."

That is the best sentence summing up Intel and AMD I have heard in a long time. AMD are now advertising, getting contracts, making better processors, and researching. Intel are just researching. That's it. I could imagine being in two rooms, one with AMD and one with Intel. In the AMD room, they would be furiously planning, but chatting and laughing at the same time. In the Intel room, everyone would be sitting in corner's staring out the windows, or watching TV. And if Intel don't buck up their ideas, AMD are easily going to over take them, just because AMD seem to care more about what they do.

We don't really know that... AMD are noticably getting contracts because they had none originally - Intel aren't because they don't need anymore, nobody who hasn't wanted them in the past is going to want them now. Intel are always advertising - every computer company who sells Intels advertises for Intel, and then there are the Centrino Adverts and CNet is full of Intel Adverts, same with MSN. We can't be sure whether Intel are researching and making better processors though... we will have to wait.

Quote:
Originally Posted by needforspeed
I'm gonna say this again, but SSE4 has some of the most balanced arguments in this forum. True, he's an Intel supporter, but unlike Lord Kalthorn he really knows what he's talking about and he also is ready to admit that in some places Intel have gone wrong.

Haha, I'm ready to admit them to myself - I'm not going to admit those faults to anybody else
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Old 03-28-2005, 06:31 PM   #100
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Default Re: New Extreme Edition - WTF!!!

You are always full of cop-outs aren't you, LK?
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