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Old 04-08-2004, 06:05 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Lord Kalthorn
Lol! The internet is Microsoft's! Perhaps - but doesn't more information on Kazaa; therefore more Music on there and more people on there more information for Microsoft and more uses of the Internet?! The more illegal software downloaded by people from their competitors means less money for those competitors and more money for Microsoft!
Which would make Microsoft as bad as the scumbags that download things off Kazaa.

Funny thing is, I bet Microsoft would bitch and moan if someone copied one of their precious Windows OS CD's right infront of them, yet, other companies are being ripped off, and know it, and can't do anything about it, but, would be able to if Microsoft did something about the Kazaa problems, and Microsoft couldn't give a shit.
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Old 04-08-2004, 06:14 PM   #32
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Nope! It is one of the reasons they are so powerful, and one of the reasons they are so hated.

Kazaa is very good though - I don't download Software and very rarely films because its so damned slow. And I don't download music which is well know or is ever going to sell a CD - Classical, old, Crap really! But I like it for that ability to download music at my discression - not having to buy CDs with predefined tracks on it. And its hard to din some of the stuff I like!
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Old 04-08-2004, 06:31 PM   #33
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Default Re: Which browser?

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Originally Posted by Lord Kalthorn
Nope! It is one of the reasons they are so powerful, and one of the reasons they are so hated.

Kazaa is very good though - I don't download Software and very rarely films because its so damned slow. And I don't download music which is well know or is ever going to sell a CD - Classical, old, Crap really! But I like it for that ability to download music at my discression - not having to buy CDs with predefined tracks on it. And its hard to din some of the stuff I like!
Microsoft have always shown to be against "Internet crimes" ... such as hacking and Virus writers (mainly because 99% of the time, it is only their systems that are affected - LMAO), yet are in a way promoting "Internet Crimes" such as illegal Downloading and breach of copyright for various companies. Just like you - you are VERY one sided about Microsoft's "greatness", yet by downloading films and music, you yourself are promoting "Internet crimes" and are promoting the very same thing that Microsoft should be against.
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Old 04-08-2004, 08:19 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocker
Microsoft have always shown to be against "Internet crimes" ... such as hacking and Virus writers (mainly because 99% of the time, it is only their systems that are affected - LMAO), yet are in a way promoting "Internet Crimes" such as illegal Downloading and breach of copyright for various companies. Just like you - you are VERY one sided about Microsoft's "greatness", yet by downloading films and music, you yourself are promoting "Internet crimes" and are promoting the very same thing that Microsoft should be against.
Yeah! Of course they have! Hacking and Virus creation is a terrible thing. What is an illegal download then? Lets see you define that?!

Downloading Films - yes - but if they're not available to buy then it can't be illegal. Which generally the films I download are. I've downloadeed Priates of the Carribbean but I have that on DVD too - I have downloaded Gladiator but I have that on DVD - dozens of films I have downloaded which I have on DVD. Illegal is to broad a term really. Copyright is only infringed if I download a film and sell it on? As I have not copied it by downloading it I have borrowed a legal copy someone else has made - everybody is allowed their own copy of a film they own.

Music! Nobody is being hurt by Music being downloaded! The charts will still be there and if it was that important then they would make file sharing programs illegal and be done with it. It obviously isn't that important.
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Old 04-08-2004, 08:39 PM   #35
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Default Re: Which browser?

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Originally Posted by Lord Kalthorn
Yeah! Of course they have! Hacking and Virus creation is a terrible thing. What is an illegal download then? Lets see you define that?!

Downloading Films - yes - but if they're not available to buy then it can't be illegal. Which generally the films I download are. I've downloadeed Priates of the Carribbean but I have that on DVD too - I have downloaded Gladiator but I have that on DVD - dozens of films I have downloaded which I have on DVD. Illegal is to broad a term really. Copyright is only infringed if I download a film and sell it on? As I have not copied it by downloading it I have borrowed a legal copy someone else has made - everybody is allowed their own copy of a film they own.

Music! Nobody is being hurt by Music being downloaded! The charts will still be there and if it was that important then they would make file sharing programs illegal and be done with it. It obviously isn't that important.
Hacking and Virus creation is only really a bad thing because of Microsoft's sloppyness ...

You say you downloaded Pirates Of The Carribean and Gladiator and still have the DVD ... that makes it right? You probably downloaded them before they came out on DVD over here. Even if you downloaded them even after you had the DVD ... WTF is the point? If you want another copy, then, you go out and buy another copy. If you want the DVD before it is released over here, tough, you wait like everyother person has to, and then rightfully pay for it on it's release date.

Music - just because it isn't "officially" illegal, that still makes it right? If you have people like the RIAA, who sued some girl for thousands of dollars for downloading a load of music, then it obviously IS a big deal. If you want something, you go out to a shop like HMV, and you pay nothing more than 3 or 4 quid and buy the single. 4 isn't really going to bunkrupt your wallet is it? Record Companies and artists are losing millions of dollars or pounds because of people like you who say "oh, it can't be that much of a deal" or "Oh, I only downloaded a few". It doesn't matter. You should have paid for those products, however "seemingly rich" the person is.
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Old 04-09-2004, 09:08 AM   #36
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Default Re: Which browser?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocker
Hacking and Virus creation is only really a bad thing because of Microsoft's sloppyness ...

You say you downloaded Pirates Of The Carribean and Gladiator and still have the DVD ... that makes it right? You probably downloaded them before they came out on DVD over here. Even if you downloaded them even after you had the DVD ... WTF is the point? If you want another copy, then, you go out and buy another copy. If you want the DVD before it is released over here, tough, you wait like everyother person has to, and then rightfully pay for it on it's release date.

Music - just because it isn't "officially" illegal, that still makes it right? If you have people like the RIAA, who sued some girl for thousands of dollars for downloading a load of music, then it obviously IS a big deal. If you want something, you go out to a shop like HMV, and you pay nothing more than 3 or 4 quid and buy the single. 4 isn't really going to bunkrupt your wallet is it? Record Companies and artists are losing millions of dollars or pounds because of people like you who say "oh, it can't be that much of a deal" or "Oh, I only downloaded a few". It doesn't matter. You should have paid for those products, however "seemingly rich" the person is.
Lol! Good points - but I don't download that much anymore because I've got most of the stuff I can think of. The advantage of keeping Kazaa is that if I hear a song on the adverts or something - even in the background of an advert - I can go and download it and listen to it. Even if I only listen to it once and delete it because its crap. For me - the travel to buy that would cost more than the CD; and the CD alone would make me flinch if I brought it because I'm tight and I can get 20 tracks for 8-12! Why get one for 4? And equally; if there was a legal P2P Music downloader I'd go and download it and I may even buy the downloader - they could get money off the advertising which makes Kazaa so fat and happy.

What I'd like to see is some kind of statistic for how much is actually lost in a Year?
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Old 04-09-2004, 09:24 AM   #37
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Default Re: Which browser?

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Originally Posted by Lord Kalthorn
What I'd like to see is some kind of statistic for how much is actually lost in a Year?
Same here. But, it is obviously a lot of money. Think how many users there are of Kazaa and/or WinMX. Millions. Say, each one of those users downloads ONE song per day (this is a minimal statistic, people obviously download more than one song a day) for each day of the year. Now, multiply that number by, say 3 (as in 3 being the normal cost for a single) ... and then, you would get the minimum amount of money that Record Companies lose each year. Quite alot when you think about it.
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Old 04-09-2004, 09:34 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by Rocker
Same here. But, it is obviously a lot of money. Think how many users there are of Kazaa and/or WinMX. Millions. Say, each one of those users downloads ONE song per day (this is a minimal statistic, people obviously download more than one song a day) for each day of the year. Now, multiply that number by, say 3 (as in 3 being the normal cost for a single) ... and then, you would get the minimum amount of money that Record Companies lose each year. Quite alot when you think about it.
Even with the high 3 Million Mark on Kazaa Users it only comes to 3 and a Quarter Billion; which lets face it is not that much of a loss to all the Record Companies of the World. Then you put in that although you'd think every user would download one piece of music a day; I doubt they do and certainly not more. The ones who did download Music would download in Batches and not all the song would come through at once. These are the ones that do - and its impossible to say buyt I'd imagine about a third of Kazaa users fit into that category. We have to face the point that Kazaa is not principally used for Music! Which some people seem to believe it is. No where near 1 percent the 4 or 5 Attobytes of Stuff on there is Music and a lot of it woudl be doubled up.

Looking at that - is it really that much of a loss?
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Old 04-09-2004, 09:46 AM   #39
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Default Re: Which browser?

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Originally Posted by Lord Kalthorn
Even with the high 3 Million Mark on Kazaa Users it only comes to 3 and a Quarter Billion; which lets face it is not that much of a loss to all the Record Companies of the World. Then you put in that although you'd think every user would download one piece of music a day; I doubt they do and certainly not more. The ones who did download Music would download in Batches and not all the song would come through at once. These are the ones that do - and its impossible to say buyt I'd imagine about a third of Kazaa users fit into that category. We have to face the point that Kazaa is not principally used for Music! Which some people seem to believe it is. No where near 1 percent the 4 or 5 Attobytes of Stuff on there is Music and a lot of it woudl be doubled up.

Looking at that - is it really that much of a loss?
Yeah, I realise that Kazaa isn't mainly used for music ... but you seemed to miss where I mentioned WinMX - which IS intended only for music - and nothing else - that program itself has millions of users. Like it or not, Kazaa is mainly used for music for alot of it's users. I myself know one or two people - one has openly admitted to having a playlist of over 2000 songs - all downloaded from Kazaa .. another openly admitting he only uses Kazaa for music, and he himself has downloaded a LOT of music. Now, take the guy with 2000 songs. Since he is american, a single would cost him not much more than say, $5 - now, mutiply $5 by 2000, and this user himself has cost companies $10,000. Now, your probably say, "that is not much compared to the amount of money the music industry has" ... but, my point is, I don't see him paying $10,000 (or a bit more, since this is an approximate estimation) for the music he is downloading (I actually think they kid is a peice of scum, and would like to see him sued for millions - but, that is out of the question, sadly). Now, that is just ONE user - there must be many others just like him.
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Old 04-09-2004, 10:12 AM   #40
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Default Re: Which browser?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocker
Yeah, I realise that Kazaa isn't mainly used for music ... but you seemed to miss where I mentioned WinMX - which IS intended only for music - and nothing else - that program itself has millions of users. Like it or not, Kazaa is mainly used for music for alot of it's users. I myself know one or two people - one has openly admitted to having a playlist of over 2000 songs - all downloaded from Kazaa .. another openly admitting he only uses Kazaa for music, and he himself has downloaded a LOT of music. Now, take the guy with 2000 songs. Since he is american, a single would cost him not much more than say, $5 - now, mutiply $5 by 2000, and this user himself has cost companies $10,000. Now, your probably say, "that is not much compared to the amount of money the music industry has" ... but, my point is, I don't see him paying $10,000 (or a bit more, since this is an approximate estimation) for the music he is downloading (I actually think they kid is a peice of scum, and would like to see him sued for millions - but, that is out of the question, sadly). Now, that is just ONE user - there must be many others just like him.
There are others like him - but not many I can imagine. The songs he downlaoded were not all worth $5 - and would not all be sold for $5. Some would be on Albums; therefore 20 Tracks would be worth $20. Some would be sold buy 1 get 1 free; 40 Tracks for $20. Eitherway is it a lot but few people have 2000 pieces of Music on their computer downloaded or otherwise. In America maybe its worse but not enough people have or know about Kazaa here - few people have broadband - and even less people can use it properly.

Anyway - people enjoy making music; not for the money but for the music (don't want to get all wierd about it, but the best music is) - and people will still be able to make wonderful Film Theme Tunes because that doesn't rely on money from Music Industries. The loss of the Music industry would not make that many people cry EVEN if it were to be crushed by Kazaa - which I doubt.
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