connchri
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ownage said:It will be good until July 23rd, I gurantee it. K8 is getting old. It used to be good, but not anymore. Core 2 will destroy it. I dont see AMD setting any records in 3D anymore. Even less in Super Pi 1M AND 32M. Conroe has better clock for clock performance than Windsor or Toledo. K8s are getting extremely hot too. 125W TDP, that is pushing the envelope toward Prescotts. Is K8L a new type of architecture? No, its only a tweaked K8. 4 core? give me a break, we barely use two right now. Intel automatically diverts to 2T, so what? It makes up for it in the higher FSB. The only thing that K8 have is high memory bandwidth. Why? cuz of IMC. Even with recommended memory, K8 will still go to 2T with 4 DIMMs populated. It is very difficult to achieve 1T with 4 DIMMs. AMDs K8 is getting old and it needs to be retired. They can try to tweak it even more, but the performance isnt going to be a drastic improvement. While Core 2 has a whole new road in front of it. There is more room for expansion. I would really like to see a 9sec super pi from ANY AMD processor.
I'm really not wanting to argue with you, but you seem to be throwing up so many unvalid points it's not funny. 1st, AMD is still leagues ahead of Intel in the 3D gaming arena-
http://tomshardware.co.uk/2006/05/23/amd_reinvents_itself_uk/page47.html
http://tomshardware.co.uk/2006/05/23/amd_reinvents_itself_uk/page48.html
So that shatters that point of them not making any new '3D records'.
Your point about the 125W thermal output is only for AMD's over the top FX-62. If you look at the following page, with the charts, you'll actually notice that all but the FX62 AMD CPUs thermal output has been lower, quite dramatically in comparison with there older models.
http://tomshardware.co.uk/2006/05/23/amd_reinvents_itself_uk/page16.html
Look how it still compares with Intels offerings. Can I also point out that your comparing it with heat dissapation from a currently released Intel CPU for the Laptop market. Your forgetting also, this is only when the CPU's on full pelt, cool'n'quite keeps it cool when not being fully utilised.
Your better performance, clock for clock rant, look through ALL the benchmarks here.
http://tomshardware.co.uk/2006/04/24/dual_core_intel_processors_for_low_uk/index.html
You'll notice that the 2.16Ghz Coreduo and the 2GHz AMD Athlon64x2 3800 are probably the most similar in benchmarks. The coreduo slaughtering it in some benchmarks (Audio encoding), the Athlon slaughtering the Core duo in others (Gaming). Other benchmarks there roughtly the same. It should be noted this is one of the 'older' 3800+, not the AM2 with DDR2 etc etc etc. So, if you were to imagine this as an AM2 AMDx2 5000+, with DDR2 etc, I think, the coreduo would have had it's pounding. Clock for clock, impressive, but not a huge deal greater than AMD, or if any better at all.
Is K8L a new type of architecture? No, its only a tweaked K8. 4 core? give me a break, we barely use two right now.
Hmm, well, the architecture of the AMD allows 4 cores easily to be implemented using one of the 3 Hypertransport buses actually designed for the Athlon 64's (that breathing room that was originall designed into it for upgrading i future). AMD cant use intels Hyperthreading so it will go 4 core to compete. It's on it's road map. Give you a break? lol
Intel automatically diverts to 2T, so what? It makes up for it in the higher FSB.
Hmm, so it's ok for Intel, but you stab at AMD for the same problem? Fanboy behavour??? What I mean is, no system currently out can run 4 1GB DIMMS at 1T, it's too unstable (i.e. not perfected) on any platform. As for the higher FSB, clever. Is that the same FSB that Intel has to use to communicate to the entire system? You know, PCIexpress through the northbridge and such? In an AMD system, the IMC means the CPU has the full bandwidth of the memory at the same time and using the full bandwidth of 2 SLI PCIexpress graphics cards, the SATA Raid HDDs, the DVD running there too. All this congest the OLD FSB architecture when the CPU wants to use the full bandwidth of the memory at the same time. Hint, thats why individual synthetic benchmarks (the one's you seem to cherish) do good on an Intel, you higher FSB. In the real world, when everything wants to use your lovely high FSB at the same time, it suffers. Besides, where is the huge difference in FSB?
Right, taking this all into consideration, and the fact this is all about current AMD K8 CPU's against Intels latest, with the K8 tweaked with bolted on 4 cores, with 2GHz Hypertransport buses, lower manufacturing process etc etc etc, there is still no problem with the K8 series. What would you replace it's architecure with? Intel still needs to let go of the FSB only setup and the lack of a IMC on a coreduo limits it's potential to the northbridge already. It's all great having a low wattage CPU, but not if your northbridge is having to make up for it. Architectly wise, even the K8 has better potential than the Coreduo! - if you think I'm wrong, give me a few examples that matter where the K8 is not. Show me where that room for expansion is. Just because the K8 is currently using it's 'room for expansion' doesn't mean it's to be retired just yet. And, it's still got the lower manufacturing processes to start on that Intel are already on, not to mention AMD's SOI patented technology.
The K8 plant been growing nicely for the last couple of years, I think it's just about to flower.