PC vs xbox360

[alvino]

GDDR3 is fast and runs at high speeds but has high latency. Keep in mind, this is a console, so there aren't any extra applications to run at the same time (of course, the 512mb helps out when you switch to the dashboard during a game etc). The RAM will be shared between the CPU and the GPU.

The Xbox 360 has a triple-cored IBM PowerPC based CPU running at 3.2ghz per core. Each core has SMT (which is similar to Intel's Hyper-Threading) and will give each core two threads per core instead of the traditional single threaded core processor.

The Xbox 360's graphics chip (also known as "Xenon") is highly misunderstood. It does not have only 48 pixel pipelines. ATI incorporated their Unified Shader Architecture into the chip, so it operates completely different compared to normal desktop GPU chips (and NO, the Xenon is not based on any desktop cores like the R520...it's annoying how rumors spread). Instead of using the traditional individual pixel pipelines and vertex shaders, ATI developed the Unified Shader Architecture and instead, had the Xenon have 48 pipelines that can be BOTH pixel AND vertex whenever the GPU needs it. This results in a more efficient design because ALL of the pipelines will be used to their capabilities instead of having some pipelines "hang around" and not do anything. ATI also added another interesting feature. Utilizing a 10mb DRAM chip (provided by the folks at NEC) it acts as a super-fast frame buffer when the GPU needs it (256 GB/s!!!), therefore increasing it's efficiency. The Xenon will run at 500mhz and will have 4x MSAA activated (who doesn't love Anti-Aliasing?!).

Yes, consoles do occasionally crash or lock up. I've had my Xbox lock up once during Halo 2.

Oh btw, they do sell Keyboard and Mouse adapters for Xbox.
http://hardware.teamxbox.com/reviews/xbox/6/Max-Shooter/p1/
http://hardware.teamxbox.com/reviews/xbox/16/MagicBox-XFPS/p1/

There's probably more else where, but would trust the ones reviewed by TeamXbox


Oh yeah...
http://news.teamxbox.com/xbox/9503/Developers-Migrating-from-PS3-to-Xbox-360-Development/

I just had to add this in! Haha, if this is true, the PS3's high costs are killing it.

Anyhoo, if you guys got more questions on the Xbox 360, feel free to ask.

 

[alvino]

one thing ive heard that the playstation three is bringing out is a USB keyboard and mice. thats going to be a big contender for the pc as the only thing i hate about consoles (apart from the inability to upgrade them) is the crappy controllers you get with them, espiecally the xbox one. its like holding a lunch box in your hands. the playstation controllers isnt that bad, i find them very good for racing games but my main love is in FPS games. i brought call of duty finest hour for my playstation 2 and havnt got past the second level due the crapness of game play provided from the controller (plus being use to cod on the pc) what a disappointment that was!! the games make the consoles at teh moment, such as the final fantasys for the playstations but now the technology that the pc game industry has been pushing for all this time has finally caught up in the consoles and gone beyond most affordable pcs today. they wont have the software crashes of pcs but i bet they will have more hardware problems, they have to cut corners somewhere to keep the price down. they deffeniatly will take a chunk out of the pc gamers market. i say good luck to them and hopfully they will provide new competiton and drive down the prices of computer components as well

Yes, as a loyal Xbox fan, I have to agree that the 1st gen controllers were the crappage. They tidied it up with the Controller S.

However, I've heard that the new Xbox 360 controller is a dream to handle and is really light and fits perfectly without really forcing anything. I sure hope so...

And yes, since the Xbox 360 and PS3 both have USB ports, it is possible for keyboard and mouse support (Hey, if you can connect a Sony PSP to a Xbox 360 through USB, then why not a keyboard or mouse?! ).

Personally, the PS3 will own EVERYTHING when it comes out, and it is THE next-gen thing to buy. Nothing is going to come close to that, which is why Microsoft sped up the XBox 360 for a Christmas release as it will lose out indeffinitely to the PS3 when it is released.

Duh. Sony has always been known for their high sales (thank the PS1). However, the outcome this time will be different. The PS3 will be the top contender, but the Xbox 360 will gain more popularity than Sony will be comfortable with. Keep in mind that the PS3 has a big price tag (and yes, even though the Xbox 360 Premium Package is $399, it allows for price-cuts when the time comes). In my opinion, the Xbox has always had the better shooters, while the PS has had more RPG games. Don't worry, the Xbox 360 has A LOT of Japanese developers this generation (Square Enix dropped Sony exclusivity! ).

 

[Kage]

Yeah, your posts made very interesting reading Alvino and The Decieved

I'd guess that physics would be counted in that 1 processor as well? Or do physics have a chance to be processed with a second processor because of how good that'd make them?

"The RAM will be shared between the CPU and the GPU"

512Mb between the GPU and the 3 CPU's?...Is that good enough? I'd guess that'd clamp down on some of the systems performance wouldn't it?

The GPU seems powerful though

You mentioned the Playstation 3 being more powerful, and thats true, yet it will have issues. For one, developers are going to find it very hard to use that extra 1 terraflop of performance (might not even be possible in use with games) and that extra 50mhz on the graphics chip...would it really make that much of a difference?...

 

[alvino]

Yeah, your posts made very interesting reading Alvino and The Decieved

I'd guess that physics would be counted in that 1 processor as well? Or do physics have a chance to be processed with a second processor because of how good that'd make them?

"The RAM will be shared between the CPU and the GPU"

512Mb between the GPU and the 3 CPU's?...Is that good enough? I'd guess that'd clamp down on some of the systems performance wouldn't it?

The GPU seems powerful though

You mentioned the Playstation 3 being more powerful, and thats true, yet it will have issues. For one, developers are going to find it very hard to use that extra 1 terraflop of performance (might not even be possible in use with games) and that extra 50mhz on the graphics chip...would it really make that much of a difference?...

The Xbox 360 won't have a physics processor like the Ageia PPU (Physics Processing Unit), but the CPU's 3 cores have a single Vector Unit per core so that will help with the physics calculations.

The 512mb shared RAM should be enough. This is a console, so it won't require as much as a PC.

 

[Kage]

Yeah, I guess so

Its a shame it won't have a physics processor like that though. The Ageia one looks so powerful. I think the PS3 takes use of that though...

Anyhow, physics should still be able to be calulated in real time and realistically, I would expect in all types of games. Like Racing (I suspect damage will become more simulated and not animated), and other types of games.

 

[alvino]

They licensed the SDK to Sony for use in games. They did so with Ubisoft and Epic Games too.

 

[Fisher]

for those of you in the UK that might be interested i just literally read in that free Metro newspaper that the xbox 360 is going ot be priced at around £210!!!!!!!!!!!! wow!!! i would pay at least £300 for one! thats a fantasic price for machine of that power! it also said they are going to release it in japan, europe and america at the same time, whihc makes a nice change, i get so feed up with everyone else having a taste of the next gen things just because they live in a differnet country. its not fair i tell you!!! it also said that microsoft will try and keep up wiht demands and produce 150,000 a week. dont know weather that was just refferring to the UK market or not

 

[Kage]

That £210 system won't be the full system, but just the core unit.

The core unit falls down in a few catorgories when you first buy it.

For example, no hard drive, no DVD remote to play them, no wireless connection (I don't think) and a few more besides. I advise, unless you want to go routing for a hard drive and remote, etc later on, to just get the £299 system, which includes everything you should need.

 

[the deceived]

The PS3 also has (I think) the better processor as it has 7 DSP within "The Cell" which means they DO work together unlike the XBox 360s three standalone processors. It seems to me as if XBox 360 is going down the PC route as it is being developed by fundamentally a PC company. It also seems as if they are trying to make the XBox 360 a home entertainment system, which scares me as it it is supposed to be a console, not a PC. Anyways, I don't want to put the XBox 360 down, it is an AWESOME machine.

Bear in mind Kage that the CPU already has it's on RAM (the L1 and L2 caches) to perform as best as possible, and as alvino said, consoles don't need anything near what a PC needs. I mean I think the extra 512MB of RAM is overkill as it is, as the job of RAM (Random Access Memory) is purely for quick access to files while performing a task. If it took the data from your hard drive everytime it wanted to perform a task, then we'd all still be waiting around for Windows to load. As games for consoles come on CD/DVD/Blu-Ray ROM (Read Only Memory), then the console reads ALL the information on the game from the CD/DVD/Blu-Ray because you don't "install" games onto a console, and there is really not other data to collect from hard drives (other than game saves) and so there is really no need for any RAM in a console. The PS3 will be using the same amount of RAM as the XBox 360, but I still think its overkill.

Come on alvino, you got that information about the PS3 pushing smaller game developers towards the Xbox 360 from "Team XBox". They'd take any chance to stir up a fuss and try and spread rumors. Lets not judge how game developers will go until both machines are released.

I think it's great though that Square Enix have dropped the exclusivity for Sony! Finally people who are XBox fans can now enjoy the best RPG series of all time! I agree with you alvino in the sense that there are more FPSs on the XBox, and there are more RPGs on the PS2. But remember that the XBox (mainly the Microsoft side of it) is coming from a western point of view (which usually involves a lot of shooting and reality) whereas the PS2 has had a lot of Japanese influence (and they are deffinitely more into fantasy and living virtual lives as in RPGs). But now that the barriers are being dropped can only mean good things to come. My only worry is that games will take longer to be released as they will have to be coded for both the XBox 360 and PS3 (and maybe even the Revolution) if they want to tie in the same release dates.

I have to admit though that (as a PS fan boy), I was shocked that the Xbox 360 is going to be released for a mere £209 ($350) brand new! I mean, in 1994 I spent £300+ on a PS1 :O If you compare the specs and the price, you'd be insane to go for the PS1! I hear that the PS3 is going to have be released at a staggering £275 - £300 ($500 - $550) just for the base model, and it could go as high as £350 ($600) for the top end package. Sony are going to lose out ALOT to the XBox 360 in terms of price, but they have built up a VERY loyal fan base and I think that is what they are relying on to get ahead in the market. But also remember that you may be spending the extra money on the PS3, you will be getting (in my opinion) the better games as game developers know that on mass, the PS3 will sell more copies of the same game than the XBox. But that all comes down to your own preference (of course)

 

[Kage]

"It also seems as if they are trying to make the XBox 360 a home entertainment system, which scares me as it it is supposed to be a console, not a PC. Anyways, I don't want to put the XBox 360 down, it is an AWESOME machine."

Though this is true, its not like Microsoft are planning on releasing Microsoft Word for the console!!!

Though what do you say to DVD's...is that home entertainment? IN which case, PS3 will be doing that too

Other than that... except for internet, there isn't really anything "Home Entertainment" about it, other than a few extra home influences like music, but thats not bad is it!!!